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3rd party machine inspection in NYC area?

DDoug

Diamond
Joined
Oct 18, 2005
Location
NW Pa
No idea yet.

My preference is for a machine appraiser/tech. I'm expecting someone with precision levels, MT 5 test bar, indicators, etc. I have a very specific set of tests I want done.
What calibration will the inspector need ?
and what liability insurance in case you don't agree ?
 

cyanidekid

Titanium
Joined
Jun 4, 2016
Location
Brooklyn NYC
Ok, well I intended to generously offer my time if it was reasonably close, but if you have no idea where it is, and insist on a “machine appraiser/ tech”, I’m out.
I’m not sure what a “precision level” would get you in an inspection???
We know what a Hardinge is capable of if it’s in reasonable condition, one of the most consistent lathes quality wise in fact. Wether it’s level or not where it sits isn’t relevant.
I’d suggest you want a rebuild with a warranty from a reputable shop, not a used machine, to meet your “particular requirements”.
if you expect someone to go and do a full evaluation to factory quality control specs on a used machine, expect to pay over 1k, and good luck finding them. And remember it may get damaged in transit anyway.
PS, if you are actually willing to pay for inspection tools and my time, I’m fully capable of doing that, lol!
 
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DDoug

Diamond
Joined
Oct 18, 2005
Location
NW Pa
Ok, well I intended to generously offer my time if it was reasonably close, but if you have no idea where it is, and insist on a “machine appraiser/ tech”, I’m out.
I’m not sure what a “precision level” would get you in an inspection???
We know what a Hardinge is capable of if it’s in reasonable condition, one of the most consistent lathes quality wise in fact. Wether it’s level or not where it sits isn’t relevant.
I’d suggest you want a rebuild with a warranty from a reputable shop, not a used machine, to meet your “particular requirements”.
if you expect someone to go and do a full evaluation to factory quality control specs on a used machine, expect to pay over 1k, and good luck finding them. And remember it may get damaged in transit anyway.
PS, if you are actually willing to pay for inspection tools and my time, I’m fully capable of doing that, lol!
From the OP "... with me watching via Facetime."
 

triumph406

Titanium
Joined
Sep 14, 2008
Location
ca
with me watching via Facetime.

Ok, put the level on the bed,
wait, move to the left so I can see the level,
now turn towards me and smile,
that sexy smile of yours,
ok,now pull down the t shirt ,
and clench those cute buttocks,


Wait a moment! I thought I was here to inspect the HLV for you


Shut up and arch your back and clench those buttocks
we can do the machine inspection later
I'm just about to to to to to to Aaargh.....

-----------------------------------------------


Sorry couldn't resist...................
 

rhb

Aluminum
Joined
Apr 27, 2019
Location
A small town in central Arkansas
Yeah, Jim. It's a 5C spindle bore. Just like God intended ;-)

I'm a bit agog that a bunch of "machinists" would not grasp the value of a precision level in a lathe evaluation.

If the bed is level and you place a precision level on the carriage and record the level reading at 1-2" increments of travel you get a pretty good evaluation of the bed wear. A custom gadget such as a King-Way is better, but a level on the carriage trimmed up with feeler gauges is good enough. And as a practical matter a more accurate description of the functional condition of the machine than any other measurement.

For the "level" of the bed there are 2 choices: reference surface or carriage at the extremes of movement. The latter allows warping the bed to provide some wear compensation. Measuring both is thus important.

For a test spindle, a 1" precision ground between centers test bar and a precision 5C collet, tenth test indicator and stand should suffice. Cantilevered from the collet TIR gives a good measure of the state of the bearings. Set between centers a height traverse should match the level results and a horizontal traverse will give the horizontal component. Everything else is alignment.

Run through all the feeds and speeds to check for chipped gears, etc. Turn the handles the full limits of travel by hand noting feel whether loose or tight.

If I can watch all that via Facetime and ask questions it will do fine and be well worth paying for. Cheaper and less hassle than taking a trip.

I'm still waiting to hear from the person who posted this:


If you can get me in touch with the seller it would be a huge help. It's on ebay, but the seller was not astute enough to put a phone number in the images.
 

triumph406

Titanium
Joined
Sep 14, 2008
Location
ca
One issue is the HLV may not have been levelled, it doesn't have to be to operate. Mine isn't level, I have never made an attempt to get it level. The casting and dovetail way is so stiff, you don't have to worry about getting the levelpads adjusted to keep the dovetail way untwisted

If there's going to wear on the bed it's going to be at the left hand side of the travel. All the wear on mine is within the last 3" of carriage travel. Mine has significant wear (not by me, previous owners) A lot of the wear on mine is also on the nearside dovetail. Evidently it didn't recieve any lube over the years.

Mounting a bar between centers may be misleading. More than anything else it might tell you the tailstock centerline varies from the spindle centerline. Which can be adjusted

My preffered test is to cut a few test diameters and check for taper and finish. My Hardinge came from the UK, and I think it's a very early HLV, still gives a mirror finish on parts when the stars align.
 

RC Mech

Stainless
Joined
Jul 21, 2014
Location
Ontario, Canada
Yeah, Jim. It's a 5C spindle bore. Just like God intended ;-)

I'm a bit agog that a bunch of "machinists" would not grasp the value of a precision level in a lathe evaluation.

If the bed is level and you place a precision level on the carriage and record the level reading at 1-2" increments of travel you get a pretty good evaluation of the bed wear. A custom gadget such as a King-Way is better, but a level on the carriage trimmed up with feeler gauges is good enough. And as a practical matter a more accurate description of the functional condition of the machine than any other measurement.

For the "level" of the bed there are 2 choices: reference surface or carriage at the extremes of movement. The latter allows warping the bed to provide some wear compensation. Measuring both is thus important.

For a test spindle, a 1" precision ground between centers test bar and a precision 5C collet, tenth test indicator and stand should suffice. Cantilevered from the collet TIR gives a good measure of the state of the bearings. Set between centers a height traverse should match the level results and a horizontal traverse will give the horizontal component. Everything else is alignment.

Run through all the feeds and speeds to check for chipped gears, etc. Turn the handles the full limits of travel by hand noting feel whether loose or tight.

“Precision level” won’t tell you dick. You could hang an HLV by the cabinet from your shop’s roof trusses and I’d wager it wouldn’t affect the monolithic casting onto which the dovetails are bolted. You want an accurate assessment of the condition of the ways you cut a test bar.

You may have never stood in front of an HLV, but there are no feed gears, or headstock gears for that matter. There’s a QCGB but your above cited tests won’t cover that.
 

rhb

Aluminum
Joined
Apr 27, 2019
Location
A small town in central Arkansas
Wow!

The least expensive option for precision work has long been the level. Gravity has always been pretty reliable from what I've heard. For example, I've never heard of a "gravity storm".

The earth is not stiff enough to resist deformation. If you walk by a sensitive level it will notice the earth around it move under you. You think an HLV is stiffer?
 

Garwood

Diamond
Joined
Oct 10, 2009
Location
Oregon
Wow!

The least expensive option for precision work has long been the level. Gravity has always been pretty reliable from what I've heard. For example, I've never heard of a "gravity storm".

The earth is not stiff enough to resist deformation. If you walk by a sensitive level it will notice the earth around it move under you. You think an HLV is stiffer?

How many machines have you inspected? You can't tell a fucking thing with a level. You can use your eyes and your ears. That's a start. 90% of a machine inspection is determining if the seller is trustworthy or an idiot.

Listen to the spindle and feeds. Run carriage full length and note any change in force. Pay attention to the z rack lash from the chuck to the tailstock.

Level is useless and stupid.

I've sold lots of machines. I've had a couple guys show up with instruments and comedically dick around for 20 minutes with no clear idea what they're doing. I've had lots of mtb techs inspect machines I've sold and they don't bring a level or a test arbor.

If you want to stop being a booksmart dumbfuck the question you need to ask is "How can I buy an expensive manual lathe far away without getting fucked?"
 








 
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