'93 Kitamura MyCenter 1 w/ Yasnac i80m controller tool change issue

[ALeroyMachinist]

I've been using this 1993(ish) MyCenter 1 for a while now, good machine and a real work horse, when it isn't having tool changing problems. It has come to a head and now it will rarely attempt a tool change. It will bring the pot down and orient the spindle but it won't do more than that.

The i80m controller throws a 1003 alarm, "1003 ATC ARM OR MAG. POSITION ALARM." No luck with consulting the available manuals found online. Pressing AUX2 and then ATC2, the controller rapidly flashes between "OK1 ATC INTIAL CONDITION" and "TA14 POT UNCLAMP DURING POT DON" I'm not sure exactly what TA is, probably tool alarm. In ATC1, all things are showing normal and good to go, the pot is indeed being clamped.

Again I have yet to see anything anywhere online or in my limited on hand literature regarding "TA." Moving the pot back to the magazine solves this issue before the proximity sensor contacts anything, about 20 degrees into the rotation, so I don't think that is where my issue lies. The pot itself is not unclamping as far as I can tell, it is movable inside the clamp but not enough to remove it entirely.

Air pressure to the machine is good, no alarms for low air pressure being thrown. There is an alarm for the encoder battery being bad (new one's in the mail), but I really doubt that is causing an issue with the tool changer. The machine is old and dirty but I have cleaned the sensors and the tool changer and such, still no luck.

Not sure what else to look at and I'll be giving Kitamura a call in the morning to see if I can get some help from them.

Any help from you all would be really appreciated.

 

[Richard King]

If the factory isn't a lot of help a friend of mine has several vintage Kitties. Check them out and if they can't help Private message me your name and number and I see if my friend can call you.

 

[DavidScott]

The pot in the down position is moveable??? It should be solid unless you don't have air pressure, which will allow it to be removed or installed if needed. My first guess would be proximity sensors since there are a few of them. Thankfully Kitamura is great about tech support so a call is a good idea.

 

[ALeroyMachinist]

The pot in the down position is moveable??? It should be solid unless you don't have air pressure, which will allow it to be removed or installed if needed. My first guess would be proximity sensors since there are a few of them. Thankfully Kitamura is great about tech support so a call is a good idea.

The pins that lock into the top of the pot are fully extended, as far as I can tell, and the pot is rotatable around the rollers that hold it up, but it can't be outright removed without pulling the air pressure. Although the clamping pins do retract slightly and then go back to the locked position when doing that so the air line may have gotten gummed up, I'll give that a look today. I looked at the proximity sensor I could find and they appear to be clean and working, when the pot is down and they are triggered, it throws a "TA15" alarm.

If the factory isn't a lot of help a friend of mine has several vintage Kitties. Check them out and if they can't help Private message me your name and number and I see if my friend can call you.

Thanks, I appreciate it.

 

[DavidScott]

What about the sensor on the arm and the knockout yoke? If the pot isn't solid in the down position then that would be the first thing I would fix, it can't be moving around while changing tools. Mine is a 2001 with no hydraulics so there may be differences. Mine will swap tools just fine down to at least 45 psi.

 

[ALeroyMachinist]

What about the sensor on the arm and the knockout yoke? If the pot isn't solid in the down position then that would be the first thing I would fix, it can't be moving around while changing tools. Mine is a 2001 with no hydraulics so there may be differences. Mine will swap tools just fine down to at least 45 psi.

Everything is sending the proper "OK" signal for the tool change to occur, I think, don't have any reference parameters. The controller sees that the pot comes down, knows it is in the down position, the pot is still locked in position. Even moving the pot around quite a bit doesn't change any of those OK parameters. I double checked and the pot lock is getting good air pressure. I also verified that the controller knows which position the pot lock is in.

If by knockout yoke, you mean something that knocks the tool out of the pot, the tools are held in the pots by spring backed bearings that act as detents on the tool. The arm just pulls straight down to overcome the detents. The motor to rotate the pot is hydraulic but I'm pretty sure that the arm actuator is pneumatic.

Talked to Kitamura service today, they recommended double checking the proximity switches, that it's likely the one that verifies the pot is in the down position that is giving me trouble. It's also the one that is the least accessible, didn't bother checking it physically yet, since the controller is getting a good signal from the switch anyway.

I think my problem lies in the pot transition somewhere, at some point in the transition the controller thinks the pot is becoming unclamped. I'm going to look at the proximity switches for the clamp position again and adjust, see if that works for me.

Either way I think I'm going to reach out to my local Kitamura dealer on Monday to see if they'll come out and service the machine.

 

[ALeroyMachinist]

An update

So I gave all the proximity sensors, as well as the tool changer assembly, a good cleaning and messed with the position of the proximity switches on the pot lock mechanism slightly. Bringing a pot down to change tools does still cause the "TA14" to flash in the AUX2 channel, but it no longer flashes as quickly and now it will change tools without issue 99 times out of 100 attempts.

I'm getting some manuals for the machine, too, so I'll take a look at the ladder logic and see if I can get a concrete answer as to what is actually tripping to cause the TA14 warning.

Another thing that might have helped is increasing the temperature of the shop, it had been cold for a while and the heater in the shop was being temperamental. Now that the shop is a consistent ~65-70, the Kitamura has been a little less resistant to operating.

 

[Garwood]

An update

So I gave all the proximity sensors, as well as the tool changer assembly, a good cleaning and messed with the position of the proximity switches on the pot lock mechanism slightly. Bringing a pot down to change tools does still cause the "TA14" to flash in the AUX2 channel, but it no longer flashes as quickly and now it will change tools without issue 99 times out of 100 attempts.

I'm getting some manuals for the machine, too, so I'll take a look at the ladder logic and see if I can get a concrete answer as to what is actually tripping to cause the TA14 warning.

Another thing that might have helped is increasing the temperature of the shop, it had been cold for a while and the heater in the shop was being temperamental. Now that the shop is a consistent ~65-70, the Kitamura has been a little less resistant to operating.

My Kitamura gets pissy in the cold as well.

 

[badr1989]

Having a kitamura mycenter 2x 1997 with yasnac I80M controler i loste all paramaetres including offset,macro.common and aux2 data.
Anyone can help ill be soooooo thankful.

 

[ALeroyMachinist]

Having a kitamura mycenter 2x 1997 with yasnac I80M controler i loste all paramaetres including offset,macro.common and aux2 data.
Anyone can help ill be soooooo thankful.

I have a few videos of the parameters that I took before going on vacation. I don't think they included anything in AUX2, macro.common, or offset. I'm also not sure how well they'll translate to your machine but I can post them soon and post a link here if you want to watch them and see if they help.

 

[badr1989]

I have a few videos of the parameters that I took before going on vacation. I don't think they included anything in AUX2, macro.common, or offset. I'm also not sure how well they'll translate to your machine but I can post them soon and post a link here if you want to watch them and see if they help.

Yes please thanks

 

[ALeroyMachinist]

Yes please thanks

Finally got around to making and uploading the video, here's the link.

 

[badr1989]

Th

Finally got around to making and uploading the video, here's the link.

ank you

 

[Roooster]

I’ve seen this before. If the mufflers on the main air manifold get gummy, it can cause back pressure up the exhausts and cause other smaller pistons in the system to move slightly out of sensor range and popping an alarm. When you go to chase it, it’s all moved back to the correct position.

 

[hruff]

I have a 1993 Shizuoka with a Yasnac I80m controller, the machine itself resembles a Kitamura MYCENTER1. I am having problems with the ATC, its like it lost something in the operating parameters, and of course the parameters list from the tool manufacturer is MIA, did not come with the machine. I have a thread on this forum that describes the problem I am having, I will try to attach it to this thread. Do you think I might be able to use the settings from a kitamura for the ATC? I know it is not a Kitamura, but Im wondering if it might be worth a shot. Any thoughts you might have on this would be greatly appreciated. Thank you

Thank you