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Cincinatti 2L Horizontal Mill - "Dad's Mill"

That manual is worth its werght in gold.
If you could find time to put that in publication reprints on V.M..org or in the manuals section here on P.M. so others could benifit.
That could be a last existing copy.

You're doing that mill up the right way.
I envey guys that had dads like yours.
Add an "in honor of dad" plack when you're finished.
 
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An update on this project. The spindle is finally moving again (as in moving out of the mill) but man it's a snails pace! The initial issue of the spindle jamming up when sliding out has been resolved. I tightened up the spanner nuts inside a little and went back to loosening and they didn't get stuck this time, so I'm thinking a key was just crooked or something.

Now the next issue! The big gear assembly on the spindle is a tight press fit. There is so little room to work with in there that it's only going at a rate of .... .001" a minute? if that? The main spanner nut that pushes on the gear has reached the end of it's threads, but the gear still has a long way to go. There are 4 jack screws between the two pieces that the manual doesn't mention about disassembly, so initially I left them alone, but since the big nut is out of thread, I turned it back a bit and am using the jack screws to push the gear off. They're a fine thread 3/8ish and I have to move them no more than 1/3 turn at a time so they keep even pressure on the gear. They were instrumental in getting it 1/2" down the spindle, but now they're about to be out of threads too! So the next step is I'm going to cut up some round steel spacers, cut them in half, then tape them around the spindle so I can keep using those little jack screws to move it in 1/2" increments. On the plus side, even though it's slow, it "feels good" like there isn't any pieces getting crushed or sheared as it's coming apart.

I've been looking at making various brackets to put pressure on the spindle with a bottle jack or something, but not a lot of good places to get the pressure in the right spot, and it would be putting the load directly on the main bearings and the spanner nut threads would be in the way too. If I can keep the snails pace up using the jack screws and spanner nut and eventually get the spindle out of the big gear, It's all going to get cleaned up and test-fitted back together on a bench before putting messing with the bearings. I'm really tempted to take a cylinder hone to the gear and make it a "snug" fit instead of this impossible to manipulate press fit they used.

Another thought I keep having is that there are companies that rebuild bearings, regrinding the elements and what-not, however they seem to only do this for big big bearings and it isn't cheap. Even still, I'd be interested if anyone has any experience with the process and I might someday take the worst of these bearings and spend a little time ID grinding whatever damage they have away. I'm thinking it's one of those things that isn't financially viable for anything but massive bearings, but given the right machines and enough time, I wonder if it could be done.....
 
VICTORY!!!!
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At least in the sense that the spindle has left the column! Lots of evenings just looking at it and thinking about where to apply pressure, then tonight some persistent nudges at different angles on various pieces along the spindle and one by one they were becoming loose as the spindle came forward. Lastly I was able to bolt a pulley puller to the back of the spindle (the kind that looks like a peace sign) and use that to push the spindle the last little bit out.
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Now that it's out, It's obvious where my problems lie. Lots of ugly orange sludge in the inside taper bearing leading to some pitted lines and fret marks. Cleaning all this up should make reassembly and any future disassembly easier. I think I could have been safe thoroughly flushing it out and halted the damage, but it would have had to come apart to fix the 'crunch'. Otherwise I was thinking about naming this mill 'Cap'n Crunch.'

Now to the next phase: I can now see the reason the manual tells you to remove the shaft bellow the spindle is because there's no room to remove most of the pieces that fit over the spindle. With some twisting and trickery I was able to remove everything but the big bull gear and the inner bearing race, which simply can't come out unless I get some room under them. So next I need to make another spanner socket to get that lower shaft apart, then after it's apart I can press in the new bearing race and start reassembling the spindle (as it get's cleaned of the rust and a few nicks pieces obtained during removal. Nothing broken though!). The front bearing and it's race, and the bearing assembly on the tail end of the spindle both look and feel fine, so I'm only going to replace the damaged one and save the other bearings for later.

Found a date on the tail bearing too.
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7-4-45 I think confirms that this mill saw major repairs after its birth in 36'. I think it also effectively proves this mill was a WW2 combat veteran in its own way. While I have profound respect for soldiers and those who went through hell on the front line, I think too often we forget about the hero's back home who worked miracles to keep our soldiers supplied with the most and best gear possible. I get a little emotional when I see warbirds, tanks and other surviving relics from that time because to me they're a testament of a nation that was unified in a cause, because regardless of the politics, everyone wanted to do their part so their sons and daughters could come home and leave the other side of the world a better freer place. It's sad that that unification isn't with us any more, but 'war finish' machines like this mill to me are another monument of that home front effort and deserve some respect. To think how much work this mill did in 9 or so years to wear out it's bearings marks it a machine-shop hero in it's own little way.

I remember when I first read about what happened at Pearl Harbor, it blew me away. We learned in school about the terrible attack, the loss of life and how it spurred America on to defend itself, but man-oh-man they didn't teach us the coolest part of how (with a couple exceptions such as the Arizona) the ships that were 'lost' in the attack were all floated and repaired in a ridiculously short amount of time! We didn't just leave them all sunk and accepted Japan's victory. That home front support is what makes me tear up. It's all just a bunch of metal and iron, but who made it work and fixed it so the hero's could do what needed to be done? Those people are hero's in my book too, and the pieces that survive today are that much cooler because of it.
 
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Been needing to post an update on this project. I made the 2nd spanner socket wrench and got the lower gear shaft out of the machine. Pictured here beside the other one I made to remove the back spindle nut.
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With that out I was able to remove both bearing races and clean the spindle bore as it had a little rust between the races. You can see how the bearing cylinders rusted and fretted against the races. After cleaning and oiling the sets, they still turn rough by hand and the new ones turn silky smooth. I think the new bearings will be a big improvement even of they are not certified class 0.
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Next I installed the new races. Carefully use of a pair of C-clamps made pressing them easy and I mic'd the pair around the perimeter to ensure they were fully seated and parallel.
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Next I cleaned the spindle and the different pieces that stack up on it and stoned and filed a few burrs down. I also found that these two bearings have slightly different ID's. They are both the same number, but the outer bearing has had its bore honed to fit a very fine step on the spindle, that way it dosn't have to press all the way across the surface. By a stroke of pure luck, the good used bearing I had bought just happened to be oversized on the ID as well! It isnt as tight of a fit as the old bearing was, but runs in the race smoothly so I'm going to use it for the outside and one of the NOS bearings for the inside.

More to come later.
 
Been needing to post an update on this project. I made the 2nd spanner socket wrench and got the lower gear shaft out of the machine. Pictured here beside the other one I made to remove the back spindle nut.
View attachment 444127
With that out I was able to remove both bearing races and clean the spindle bore as it had a little rust between the races. You can see how the bearing cylinders rusted and fretted against the races. After cleaning and oiling the sets, they still turn rough by hand and the new ones turn silky smooth. I think the new bearings will be a big improvement even of they are not certified class 0.
View attachment 444128
Next I installed the new races. Carefully use of a pair of C-clamps made pressing them easy and I mic'd the pair around the perimeter to ensure they were fully seated and parallel.
View attachment 444129
Next I cleaned the spindle and the different pieces that stack up on it and stoned and filed a few burrs down. I also found that these two bearings have slightly different ID's. They are both the same number, but the outer bearing has had its bore honed to fit a very fine step on the spindle, that way it dosn't have to press all the way across the surface. By a stroke of pure luck, the good used bearing I had bought just happened to be oversized on the ID as well! It isnt as tight of a fit as the old bearing was, but runs in the race smoothly so I'm going to use it for the outside and one of the NOS bearings for the inside.

More to come later.
Nice work, I like how you have everything spotlessly clean.

Regards Tyrone
 
Nice work, I like how you have everything spotlessly clean.

Regards Tyrone
Taking this apart, I've been surprised how few seals there are and how open the gearbox is to the outside. If the oil stays clean it should keep stray dirt and swarf flushed out, but with enough grime build up in the right places it will block oil from trickling down to where it's needed. With that in mind, all this frustration could have been avoided if we had put a tarp over this will when it was in the warehouse with the leaky roof. It looked like it had just gotten surface rust on the mill, but water dripped in and did it's damage.

It certainly wasn't clean when I started as I was cleaning and refinishing the exterior a section at a time in between jobs, and with that I was hoping to just do a "quick bearing change" before learning how tight the gears are pressed onto the spindle (in addition to the bearing rust). It would have been better to recognize that the mill would be out of service for awhile and just wash down the whole machine at the start, but I'm keeping the gearbox covered when I'm not working on it and cleaning the individual parts as they go back together.
 
My 12" American had the spindle bearing oil gallery mostly blocked by accumulated dirt that drifted in around the labyrinth over the years. The bearings are fine so I guess some oil was making it- I discovered the dirt after getting the rest of the oil system working right and saw dirty oil leaking out of the labyrinth- took it off and found the crud.
 








 
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