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I guess its time for me to start my own Home shop thread.

After watching the first 1/2 of the eclipse here, I was thinking that when we were around 85% (my guess) that the light outside looked about like a typical cloudy winter day here.

I understand that you are new to our area, and this has been a [very extreme] El Ni'No winter, but normally we can go weeks in the winter w/o seeing the sun, and when we doo, it will be for a short time, and then back in the clouds aggin.

I just wonder how much the graphs and charts relay this?
Doo they de-rate the winter to what a clear day would be?
Or what a typical day in your area would be?
I am thinking that there is a large gap between those 2 figgers?


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I am Ox and I approve this here post!

Internet says 10-25% rated power output for solar on very cloudy days.

So you need 4x to 10x the solar panels to get same power output in winter as summer.
 
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So I guess I was right on par eh? :eek:

I was wondering if ... whatever rays that solar uses ... got through the clouds at the same rate as the light?
I guess it's about the same then.

So that renders about any solar field around here worthless in the winter....
But - in all fairness, hot summer DAYS are typically the highest draw on the grid, so I guess they help with peak.


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I am Ox and I approve this here post!
 
After watching the first 1/2 of the eclipse here, I was thinking that when we were around 85% (my guess) that the light outside looked about like a typical cloudy winter day here.

I understand that you are new to our area, and this has been a [very extreme] El Ni'No winter, but normally we can go weeks in the winter w/o seeing the sun, and when we doo, it will be for a short time, and then back in the clouds aggin.

I just wonder how much the graphs and charts relay this?
Doo they de-rate the winter to what a clear day would be?
Or what a typical day in your area would be?
I am thinking that there is a large gap between those 2 figgers?


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I am Ox and I approve this here post!
i've been told that. i will add another backup/failsafe eventually when i can afford to.
 
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So I guess I was right on par eh? :eek:

I was wondering if ... whatever rays that solar uses ... got through the clouds at the same rate as the light?
I guess it's about the same then.

So that renders about any solar field around here worthless in the winter....
But - in all fairness, hot summer DAYS are typically the highest draw on the grid, so I guess they help with peak.


-----------------

I am Ox and I approve this here post!
with how cheap panels are these days, its pennies to add more to make up in the winter. $70 per 550w panel is dirt cheap! i've got land to potentially put in hundreds of them if i wanted to, not that i ever will.
 
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Gotta love seeing light through your walls!

Now that I think about it, how would I even use something like rockwool on these walls without studs every 16"?
 
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Just be glad it's not a Morton barn.
Their corner gussets make it nigh impossible to get a clean seal on your walls/ceiling.
And they are on 9' centers... :ack2:

We insulated our Morton - that we use for storage.
It's not heated, just insulated, so no temp swings and no sweat.

But it is interesting where we can see the small corner section where there was a little shop built into it, that is still not insulated. You can see it on the outside of the sheetmetal - as part has dampness and the other part does not.
Just batting and a wrap inside.


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Think Snow Eh!
Ox
 
To use batts in a pole barn you can frame interior walls with vertical studs. I like to use 2x4 studs, but space them flush with the inside of the posts and install 6" thick insulation.

The big thing with batt insulation and pole barns is that critters love it! I don't see why rockwool would be any different. If mice can get in your walls they'll tell all their buddies and they'll fill those walls up!

When I realized how bad it was in my shop I fixed what I could and tinned over all the sheetrock with white steel siding.
 
The big thing with batt insulation and pole barns is that critters love it! I don't see why rockwool would be any different. If mice can get in your walls they'll tell all their buddies and they'll fill those walls up!
Free heating from the little furry bodies and free insulation from all the little turds.
 
Yes you have to stud the wall, but you will need to anyway fasten the interior sheathing to anyway. Use 2x6s so you can use 6" thick wool which is R26 here. Rock wool does not compress like fiberglass and will not sag/compress down in the wall over time. You will however have to cut it more accurately than the pink stuff, but yo can still fill any small holes or gaps with 'glass if need be. After I put up the interior vapor barrier, and since the shop was heated, any air leaks showed up as moisture on the plastic which was easy to fix with wool or a can of spray foam.
 
Yes you have to stud the wall, but you will need to anyway fasten the interior sheathing to anyway. Use 2x6s so you can use 6" thick wool which is R26 here. Rock wool does not compress like fiberglass and will not sag/compress down in the wall over time. You will however have to cut it more accurately than the pink stuff, but yo can still fill any small holes or gaps with 'glass if need be. After I put up the interior vapor barrier, and since the shop was heated, any air leaks showed up as moisture on the plastic which was easy to fix with wool or a can of spray foam.

2x6's are not the same thickness as the posts. 6x6 posts are not 5.5" square, they are 5.75"-6" (if that's what his building has). So when you frame the interior wall structure you space the studs to line up with the inboard surface of the posts so your sheeting doesn't look like shit.

That's why I said use 2x4's instead of 2x6's to frame the walls because you will use 6" thick insulation, but your interior studs won't be connected to the exterior studs.

Make sense?
 
2x6's are not the same thickness as the posts. 6x6 posts are not 5.5" square, they are 5.312"-5.375" (if that's what his building has). So when you frame the interior wall structure you space the studs to line up with the inboard surface of the posts so your sheeting doesn't look like shit.

That's why I said use 2x4's instead of 2x6's to frame the walls because you will use 6" thick insulation, but your interior studs won't be connected to the exterior studs.

Make sense?


Fixed it fer yuh.


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I am Ox and I approve this here post!
 
I went through the same thing you’re doing. Before you start doing anything to the interior, I recommend digging around 6-8 poles to see how many are rotted out. If the poles are good, shoot the truss carriers with a laser to see how far they’re out and level as necessary. Pulling the 1960 barn spikes on my building was almost impossible so I ended up cutting most of the heads off. One side of my building was out 2-7/8”.

I know it’s hillbilly but I nailed blocks to the poles and screwed the 2x4’s flush between them for plywood and insulation. The building doesn’t rack and everything is solid so far.
 

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I went through the same thing you’re doing. Before you start doing anything to the interior, I recommend digging around 6-8 poles to see how many are rotted out. If the poles are good, shoot the truss carriers with a laser to see how far they’re out and level as necessary. Pulling the 1960 barn spikes on my building was almost impossible so I ended up cutting most of the heads off. One side of my building was out 2-7/8”.

I know it’s hillbilly but I nailed blocks to the poles and screwed the 2x4’s flush between them for plywood and insulation. The building doesn’t rack and everything is solid so far.
nice work!
 
Spray foam the inside. Cover the poles too, they're thermal breaks.

Any air-permeable insulation (fiberglass, rockwool or cellulose) with a vapor barrier on the cold side will load up with moisture. The metal siding is a vapor barrier, so is on the outside. Closed cell foam as the only reasonable alternative. It is its own vapor barrier, seals against the siding really well, but you knew that already.:)
 
The metal siding is only a vapor barrier if it is very well sealed. The main path for moisture to get into walls is air movement. The other main moisture path is bad water sealing on the outside...
 
Well, in all fairness, they grow'm a little bigger in your neck ..... over your way....


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I am Ox and I approve this here post!

I spose they do. Back in '14 I was trying to buy a commercial building for my shop. The 11K sq ft building I was trying to buy was built in the 1920's as a truck repair shop for log trucks. It was heavy timber framed with massive bolted arch trusses. On one of the walls was a built in wood workbench 4 feet deep. It was about 60 feet long. The top on that workbench was one piece of wood.
 
The metal siding is only a vapor barrier if it is very well sealed. The main path for moisture to get into walls is air movement. The other main moisture path is bad water sealing on the outside...

The model I'm thinking of is warm inside air migrating to the cold outside metal that causes condensation at the metal, or anywhere the dewpoint within the insulation is reached. If the air seal is perfect on the inside, there's no chance of condensation, I get that. The problem being that this building won't have a perfect air seal. No where near.

Agreed that water getting in through the outside ain't good either.
 








 
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