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Ideal BT30 Aluminum Finisher?

How confident are you that it isn't a material related?

I am fairly ignorant with aluminum (i'll be posting a slew of questions this week to demonstrate) but I did a job a couple years ago, high surface finish requirement, parts came out beautiful. Last year customer wanted another batch. Same everything, material was even from the same supplier, but had a murky/milky finish to it. We wound up having to tumble the parts to give them a uniform finish.
 
Not in my experience. I have a 3/4 necked 3 flue Alu-Power that has roughed a ton of 7075 aluminum at full flute length and about a 30% stepover, just ripping that material off. Still looks brand new after 3 months of cutting.

Is that such a claim to fame though?

With the exception of coatings discoloring, every tool I run only in aluminum still looks pretty new.

There is a reason every tooling catalog has 8000 options for tools in steel/titanium/iron/inconel/etc and only a couple of aluminum lines... there is no money selling tools for cutting 6061 because they last forever.
 
I did a job a couple years ago, high surface finish requirement, parts came out beautiful. Last year customer wanted another batch. Same everything, material was even from the same supplier, but had a murky/milky finish to it.

What was this troublesome non-aluminum mystery material?
 
Is that such a claim to fame though?

With the exception of coatings discoloring, every tool I run only in aluminum still looks pretty new.

There is a reason every tooling catalog has 8000 options for tools in steel/titanium/iron/inconel/etc and only a couple of aluminum lines... there is no money selling tools for cutting 6061 because they last forever.
It sounds like you haven't had tools break just because they had too many hours on them? I have had tools break way before they should and corners that chip when they shouldn't, both regularly from those suppliers.
 
I mean... how exotic do you want to get?

Semi-exotic; Frasia has their NX line that is producing bonkers good floor finishes. I've seen folks have success with them in aluminum, despite not being ground or coated for it.

Super-exotic; a couple of companies are now making helical fluted PCD end mills, in standard sizes, that can have wiper flats and corner geometry tuned for the exact DOC you'll be running. These are all custom, and like $800+ each.
can attest to fraisa tools being TOP NOTCH, but price tag reflects that.
 
For Aluminum, sounds like the ole' "buying the Ferrari to deliver pizza's" :D
i mean... to each his own. i've personally never been able to achieve the finishes i've gotten with their tools, using any other brand. but i'm a know-nothing-nobody, and they make it dead ass easy for me to look like i know wtf i'm doing, so i'll take what i can get!
 
It sounds like you haven't had tools break just because they had too many hours on them? I have had tools break way before they should and corners that chip when they shouldn't, both regularly from those suppliers.

I've never had an aluminum tool just flat out break on me while running a stable process. Of course - I've killed enough aluminum tools I could have bought a nice CPO BMW 3 series at this point; but purely through bozo moves on my part.

Caveats:
1- I don't run low-end tools. I'm pretty much a Helical/SwiftCarb/Frasia/Destiny kind of guy when it comes to aluminum tooling on my own stuff and turnkeys I'm doing for customers.

2- This is mostly running in high-end holders - Big Daishowa, RegoFix, shrink, etc. Nobody around here doing mass-scale work is buying low-end holders.

3- I am actually a giant sissy when it comes to feeds/speeds/engagements. I'm an absolute psychopath on eliminating non-cut time in a cycle, but the actual in-cut process? Extremely cautious. Usually no more than 10% nominal book feeds/speeds, properly applied high accuracy to not dive into corners + proper corner cautions/process.
 
For Aluminum, sounds like the ole' "buying the Ferrari to deliver pizza's" :D

If you have to deliver pizzas, wouldn't you want to do it in a Ferrari?

Most of my customer base here are owner/operators. I'm an owner/operator. One thing a lot of people in our industry do not even begin to comprehend is that - in situations where the person paying for the machine is the one who is going to run it - quality of life matters way more, machine usability matters more, and using tooling that performs exceptionally well is a big deal because it enhanced the workday experience.

It is why, for example, I totally understand why that John Grimsmo guy bought a Kern - it makes zero sense to buy that machine to make those parts, but he is the guy running it every day. His quality of life is directly connected to the quality of time he has when he gets to actually do the thing he loves; making parts.
 
Carbide and grind differences in decent Aluminum tools your not gonna notice the difference.
You'll notice if you buy cheap non micro grained, sure.

I don't run YG1 because the polish flutes leave mirror finishes yes, but after running varied height parts they leave lines in parts, a non polished like the Helical I run you don't see lines, but you also don't get a mirror ever.
Pick your poison.

And if I have to pay for the Ferrari, NO!
 
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If you have to deliver pizzas, wouldn't you want to do it in a Ferrari?

Most of my customer base here are owner/operators. I'm an owner/operator. One thing a lot of people in our industry do not even begin to comprehend is that - in situations where the person paying for the machine is the one who is going to run it - quality of life matters way more, machine usability matters more, and using tooling that performs exceptionally well is a big deal because it enhanced the workday experience.

It is why, for example, I totally understand why that John Grimsmo guy bought a Kern - it makes zero sense to buy that machine to make those parts, but he is the guy running it every day. His quality of life is directly connected to the quality of time he has when he gets to actually do the thing he loves; making parts.
WELL SAID!
its like what i've said in a lot of the haas threads before, of course i COULD make a haas do what i want/need it to do, but with a better machine, i dont need to fuck a monkey to get it to do the job. its really weird, once i've tried working with quality tools, 99% of the time they just WORK and do what i want them to do without having to break my head about all kinds of fucked up workarounds. there's a LOT to be said about that.
 
WELL SAID!
its like what i've said in a lot of the haas threads before, of course i COULD make a haas do what i want/need it to do, but with a better machine, i dont need to fuck a monkey to get it to do the job. its really weird, once i've tried working with quality tools, 99% of the time they just WORK and do what i want them to do without having to break my head about all kinds of fucked up workarounds. there's a LOT to be said about that.
100% you gotta be analytical about the 'value' of things.
And it's not always just $$ in that equation.

Or I wouldn't have AC and mist collectors and dehumidifiers, and pro level software and hardware...
 
It was aluminum, have to dig to find the material paperwork, but it was a US 6061.
We get some US local Provo, 6061 T6, that stuff is absolutely not the same as anything Ive ever ran. It acts far more like 7075.
 
It was aluminum, have to dig to find the material paperwork, but it was a US 6061.

Weird. I've only gotten a murky finish on aluminum when there was either buildup on the cutter due to insufficient lubrication or chips were getting recut. Or on a lathe if a bird's nest rubs against the finished surface.

But, it sounds like the OP's problem is "mild chatter" rather than smearing.
 
I use mainly Destiny Vipers with the stealth coating for finishing. Excellent finishes. I use some YG1 Alumpowers also which leave great finishes also just don't rough with them. The snap off if you look at them funny.

I rough and finish with the same YG-1 whether it be 1/4-5/16-3/8-1/2, there very durable. Last for ever, unless there's an 'accident'

The only YG-1 I've worn out was a 1/8 3 flute, I calculated it had removed 96cuin of material, before the finish started to degrade.

They don't like being rapided into vises, or plunging/deep slotting when the coolant is slow to turn on.
 
We get some US local Provo, 6061 T6, that stuff is absolutely not the same as anything Ive ever ran. It acts far more like 7075.
Weird, I've always had better luck with 7075, getting good finishes, but it's been 10+ years since I've run any, that just on a Bridgeport EZ trak.
Weird. I've only gotten a murky finish on aluminum when there was either buildup on the cutter due to insufficient lubrication or chips were getting recut. Or on a lathe if a bird's nest rubs against the finished surface.

But, it sounds like the OP's problem is "mild chatter" rather than smearing.
I wasn't sure what the issue was. I run cutting oil, and the cutter was getting plenty of it. Very minimal chips, as not much material was being removed (1/4 wide 3/4 tall, cutting it down to .206 wide). It didn't have the appearance of smearing from chips, I know what you mean there. This was.... in the material, the material itself. The part was shiny and smooth, but milky is the only way I can describe it.
 
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I've never had an aluminum tool just flat out break on me while running a stable process. Of course - I've killed enough aluminum tools I could have bought a nice CPO BMW 3 series at this point; but purely through bozo moves on my part.

Caveats:
1- I don't run low-end tools. I'm pretty much a Helical/SwiftCarb/Frasia/Destiny kind of guy when it comes to aluminum tooling on my own stuff and turnkeys I'm doing for customers.

2- This is mostly running in high-end holders - Big Daishowa, RegoFix, shrink, etc. Nobody around here doing mass-scale work is buying low-end holders.

3- I am actually a giant sissy when it comes to feeds/speeds/engagements. I'm an absolute psychopath on eliminating non-cut time in a cycle, but the actual in-cut process? Extremely cautious. Usually no more than 10% nominal book feeds/speeds, properly applied high accuracy to not dive into corners + proper corner cautions/process.
Dataflute and Bassett both made good solid end mills until they were sold. Afterward, the carbide used was crap which quickly became evident.

If the run is big enough I find out how hard I can push the tools. It is often far faster than most realize they can go.
 
This was.... in the material, the material itself. The part was shiny and smooth, but milky is the only way I can describe it.

The only time I've seen anything in a piece of aluminum was when face grooving extruded 6061 on a lathe with the extrusion axis at right angles to Z. Then I saw what looked like scratches down at the bottom of the groove all going in the direction of the extrusion axis.
 
Carbide and grind differences in decent Aluminum tools your not gonna notice the difference.
You'll notice if you buy cheap non micro grained, sure.

I don't run YG1 because the polish flutes leave mirror finishes yes, but after running varied height parts they leave lines in parts, a non polished like the Helical I run you don't see lines, but you also don't get a mirror ever.
Pick your poison.

And if I have to pay for the Ferrari, NO!
This was my finding. My recent problem parts have a 1-5/8 tall side milled surface that needs to look good. Most cutters I tried right out of the box did a poor job of top to bottom consistency on this feature. Non polished edge cutters at least gave a fairly consistent grain pattern top to bottom. Polished edge tools mostly couldn’t make a nice finish over the whole face. The exception was the swifcarb cutter which gave a beautiful finish top to bottom.
 
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