Is SW CAM / CAMWorks as clunky and useless as it looks?

[BugRobotics]

Hey Marvel, I sent you a link to the model a few days ago via private message.

I was using Autodesk Screencast. I think it's free.

 

[Marvel]

Hey Marvel, I sent you a link to the model a few days ago via private message.

I was using Autodesk Screencast. I think it's free.

I found it! I never notice the notifications at the top. Ill post a video today.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[gkoenig]

For me, $12k for CAMWorks upfront wasn't much of a problem and the annual maintenance at $3600 isn't much either, its not even 1% of my annual sales. I can easily justify that by the money I get for my scrap.

Hold up... a CAMWorks/SolidWorks seat is $12k upfront, and $3,600 a year? WTF?

That is within spitting distance ($15k) of what my 3 axis CAD/CAM seat of NX cost me, and I'm paying $200 a year less in maintenance. Having been a SolidWorks user for a decade before, and having messed around with CAMWorks for a few months on an extended trial, NX is playing in a totally different ballpark in software quality and capability. I'm shocked that the cost difference is literally $3k, because it feels like it should be 3-4x that.
dd

 

[Marvel]

Here's the same part BugRobotics programmed in HSMWorks but programmed in CAMWorks.

CAMWorks Tutorial | Search | Autodesk Knowledge Network

It was actually this weekend I looked into and think I figured out why CAMWorks has the two tabs/two step process, where you create the operation and then creating the tool paths.

I noticed with the HSMWorks BugRobits posted you create the operation and toolpath essentially in one.

So I tried to explain the 3 ways to create tool paths, using AFR, creating operations where it still recognizes features to an extent and utilizes the TechDB data and the way to create the operation/tool path the conventional way similar to how other CAM does it where CAMWorks doesn't pull in any part data and you select the tools, parameters, etc. but I did notice it did still use some default speeds, feeds, DOC, step over settings, again what is similar to how other CAM software has you create tool paths and select tools, a more conventional way of programming rather than automating some of the parameters.

Disclaimer: The AFR does great with fairly simple parts like this, if you have complex parts, you can use it, but IMO it doesn't do great. I typically don't use the AFR but I do use the TechDB in my favor for when I'm creating operations in the order I see best for a complex part.

 

[Marvel]

Hold up... a CAMWorks/SolidWorks seat is $12k upfront, and $3,600 a year? WTF?

That is within spitting distance ($15k) of what my 3 axis CAD/CAM seat of NX cost me, and I'm paying $200 a year less in maintenance. Having been a SolidWorks user for a decade before, and having messed around with CAMWorks for a few months on an extended trial, NX is playing in a totally different ballpark in software quality and capability. I'm shocked that the cost difference is literally $3k, because it feels like it should be 3-4x that.
dd

Well as far as annual maintenance I think the CAMWorks users get a little screwed being CAMWorks utilized SolidWorks as it’s only CAD platform and they are two separate companies, so we have to pay two annual maintenance fees.

So my CAMWorks portion of annual maintenance is $1875 and I also have an annual maintenance for Volumill add on that’s $300, then there’s the SolidWorks annual cost on top of that. I’d have to verify but my annual cost just recently went up around $600.

Now upfront cost, CAMWorks doesn’t offer modules anymore, a few years ago they switched to bundle packages, so I have the CAMWorks Milling Professional package, which includes Milling which includes 3 + 2 indexing, 3 axis surfacing tool paths as well as Turning, Mill-Turn, Rotary Milling, and a few other miscellaneous options. So that $12k includes all that.

In 2018 when I was in the market, it came down to CAMWorks or NX and the quote I received for NX Mill package alone was $19k and $3900 annual cost. I was able to negotiate that price down significantly close to CAMWorks upfront cost. In 2018 I didn’t have them add in any cost for turning, I actually don’t do any turning and feel CAMWorks is over priced having the bundle packages they have now.

Now being CAMWorks was and is the only software I find comparable to NX, they both offer a great integrated CAD/CAM package, I do find NX slightly more superior in a few ways, it is a considerable change I contemplate every year and a couple months ago I had NX quoted again and found they are moving to a subscription based platform and for Milling alone it was $16k for a 3 year subscription, paid in full upfront. I asked about turning and that was an additional $6k. I’m not a fan of subscription based software, I don’t like the idea that if a time comes I don’t want to continue paying annually I lose everything. Whereas with the traditional license once you stop paying your annual fees you are just stuck on that year but forever own that seat.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[gkoenig]

Now being CAMWorks was and is the only software I find comparable to NX, they both offer a great integrated CAD/CAM package, I do find NX slightly more superior in a few ways, it is a considerable change I contemplate every year and a couple months ago I had NX quoted again and found they are moving to a subscription based platform and for Milling alone it was $16k for a 3 year subscription, paid in full upfront. I asked about turning and that was an additional $6k. I’m not a fan of subscription based software, I don’t like the idea that if a time comes I don’t want to continue paying annually I lose everything. Whereas with the traditional license once you stop paying your annual fees you are just stuck on that year but forever own that seat.

NX offers subscriptions, but (at least as was explained to me) they are primarily targeted at larger NX shops who need an economic way to expand/collapse their seat count to match their workload. Of course, NX is still primarily a perpetual license situation, and the subscriptions are priced out at exactly a 5 year term before a perpetual seat with annual maintenance quickly creams the numbers in it's favor.

If you are doing 3+2 programming, you aren't missing much with NX. It has some great tricks up it's sleeve for very specific situations, but honestly? Fusion is way faster to learn, easier to templitize for your environment, and you can go buy a nice car with the price difference between it and NX. I think we're getting to the point of maturity in the industry where 3+2 programming and turning tools are basically all interchangeable; the real competition is in 5 axis, mill/turn, additive, machine simulation, robotic machining... all areas where NX is either the leader of the class or sitting in the front row area. But if 3+2 milling is your end goal, save your money.

NX CAD is a different story. I think it is objectively the best CAD system in existence and even the base Mach 1 seat that comes with the 3 Axis milling package is a beast that makes Fusion or SolidWorks look and feel like toys. Once you climb the NX learning curve, the CAD side gives you capabilities and efficiencies that really do make it worth the premium. I mean, damn...Synchronous Modeling alone is worth an easy $5k if you work with anyone else's geometry.

 

[Marvel]

NX offers subscriptions, but (at least as was explained to me) they are primarily targeted at larger NX shops who need an economic way to expand/collapse their seat count to match their workload. Of course, NX is still primarily a perpetual license situation, and the subscriptions are priced out at exactly a 5 year term before a perpetual seat with annual maintenance quickly creams the numbers in it's favor.

If you are doing 3+2 programming, you aren't missing much with NX. It has some great tricks up it's sleeve for very specific situations, but honestly? Fusion is way faster to learn, easier to templitize for your environment, and you can go buy a nice car with the price difference between it and NX. I think we're getting to the point of maturity in the industry where 3+2 programming and turning tools are basically all interchangeable; the real competition is in 5 axis, mill/turn, additive, machine simulation, robotic machining... all areas where NX is either the leader of the class or sitting in the front row area. But if 3+2 milling is your end goal, save your money.

NX CAD is a different story. I think it is objectively the best CAD system in existence and even the base Mach 1 seat that comes with the 3 Axis milling package is a beast that makes Fusion or SolidWorks look and feel like toys. Once you climb the NX learning curve, the CAD side gives you capabilities and efficiencies that really do make it worth the premium. I mean, damn...Synchronous Modeling alone is worth an easy $5k if you work with anyone else's geometry.

I’m a small one man shop, when I had the discussion with NX and expressed my concerned with it being a subscription they came back and said they understand my concern and would be willing to look into perpetual license and would discuss it with Siemens, but I felt it would have turned into one of them things 2 years down the road I’d be pushed into a subscription. Maybe not though.

This was the quote - NX CAM-Only 3 Axis Milling [NX12480] – Price: $15,804.00 (3 Year Subscription)

So from where I’m at annually with CAMWorks it’s an additional $1600/yr, IMO it’s not that much more for NX from a sole milling standpoint being I don’t use anything other than milling currently but I may add a turning center this year so feel it just make sense to stick with CAMWorks where I have a turning module if ever needed.

Cost wise isn’t much of a concern for me, the annual cost is less than 1% of my annual sales and the way I see it, the CAM software is the first step in producing a part off the machine and is an important “tool” and I spend 10x that on consumable tooling.

Messed around in Fusion a couple times, not much of a fan and I have some ITAR customers that prefer it not to be used, they haven’t directly stayed I couldn’t but have made it clear they prefer their models not to be programmed in Fusion.

I’ve done two NX trials and really liked just about everything it offered and have known a couple to go from CAMWorks to NX and said it has been worth the additional cost.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Marvel]

NX offers subscriptions, but (at least as was explained to me) they are primarily targeted at larger NX shops who need an economic way to expand/collapse their seat count to match their workload. Of course, NX is still primarily a perpetual license situation, and the subscriptions are priced out at exactly a 5 year term before a perpetual seat with annual maintenance quickly creams the numbers in it's favor.

If you are doing 3+2 programming, you aren't missing much with NX. It has some great tricks up it's sleeve for very specific situations, but honestly? Fusion is way faster to learn, easier to templitize for your environment, and you can go buy a nice car with the price difference between it and NX. I think we're getting to the point of maturity in the industry where 3+2 programming and turning tools are basically all interchangeable; the real competition is in 5 axis, mill/turn, additive, machine simulation, robotic machining... all areas where NX is either the leader of the class or sitting in the front row area. But if 3+2 milling is your end goal, save your money.

NX CAD is a different story. I think it is objectively the best CAD system in existence and even the base Mach 1 seat that comes with the 3 Axis milling package is a beast that makes Fusion or SolidWorks look and feel like toys. Once you climb the NX learning curve, the CAD side gives you capabilities and efficiencies that really do make it worth the premium. I mean, damn...Synchronous Modeling alone is worth an easy $5k if you work with anyone else's geometry.

I just looked back at my emails with the NX reseller I was talking to, this was what he had to say about the subscription…….

“Currently, perpetual licensing is still available. However, we just got back from a Siemens reeducational conference last week and they are moving everything to subscription and it's an uphill battle for any new perpetual licensing. Perpetual licensing will eventually all disappear it's just a matter of when.”


I totally get it, seeing a lot of software moving to subscriptions in the last few years, I have some other software that have all moved to subscriptions. I think it’s only a matter of time before more CAM companies follows, my struggle is just the cost of CAM software and losing it with subscriptions. I think companies are seeing the long term income with subscriptions knowing there’s a lot of shops that don’t care for annual upgrades and are ok being stuck on older software, whereas with a subscription you don’t have much of a choice and are somewhat forced to pay to play.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[SeymourDumore]

If you are doing 3+2 programming, you aren't missing much with NX. It has some great tricks up it's sleeve for very specific situations, but honestly? Fusion is way faster to learn, easier to templitize for your environment, and you can go buy a nice car with the price difference between it and NX. I think we're getting to the point of maturity in the industry where 3+2 programming and turning tools are basically all interchangeable; the real competition is in 5 axis, mill/turn, additive, machine simulation, robotic machining... all areas where NX is either the leader of the class or sitting in the front row area. But if 3+2 milling is your end goal, save your money.

NX CAD is a different story. I think it is objectively the best CAD system in existence and even the base Mach 1 seat that comes with the 3 Axis milling package is a beast that makes Fusion or SolidWorks look and feel like toys.

OK, so this is the point where the conversation became interesting...,

Just like the OP, I am/was a longtime FeatureCAM user with perpetual license on maintenance.
In addition, I am/was also an Autodesk Inventor PDSU user with a perpetual license on maintenance.
Even though ADSK stopped selling perpetual licenses back 2015, they have grandfathered in the existing Perpetual licenses and allowed us to remain
updated as long as we've not let our maintenance elapse.

Well, as of May 7, 2021, ADSK has switched to the Named User license scheme, and as a result we were/are no longer able to pay for our perpetual license to remain up-to-date.

So, I am ( and likely a few others as well ) now looking for which direction to go with when the time comes....
While the OP is looking to add something to help with immediate needs, I am guessing he is also looking to make that to be something "perpetual"
He does have an active FeatureCAM-Ultimate subscription, which means he has full access to everything Fusion has to offer. By everything Fusion, I mean EVERYTHING FUSION!!!

And yet, he is asking for something not ADSK, and quite possibly not rent-A-software ( SAAS if you will )

Well, so am I!

Since allowing both of my ( Inventor PDSU and FeatureCAM Premium ) licenses expire, I have saved over $8K, only to be put towards to whatever comes next.
My needs are 95% 3+1 milling and 5% full 3D. No 5 axis, no additive, not even 3+2 or mill/turn, even though I have that with my FC-Premium package...
At the same time, I also will need a new CAD platform as well.....

So, in that realm, what - if anything - does NX has to offer?

( Gregor: Sorry to somewhat sidetrack your thread, but we are somewhat in the similar boat !!! )

 

[gregormarwick]

OK, so this is the point where the conversation became interesting...,

Just like the OP, I am/was a longtime FeatureCAM user with perpetual license on maintenance.
In addition, I am/was also an Autodesk Inventor PDSU user with a perpetual license on maintenance.
Even though ADSK stopped selling perpetual licenses back 2015, they have grandfathered in the existing Perpetual licenses and allowed us to remain
updated as long as we've not let our maintenance elapse.

Well, as of May 7, 2021, ADSK has switched to the Named User license scheme, and as a result we were/are no longer able to pay for our perpetual license to remain up-to-date.

So, I am ( and likely a few others as well ) now looking for which direction to go with when the time comes....
While the OP is looking to add something to help with immediate needs, I am guessing he is also looking to make that to be something "perpetual"
He does have an active FeatureCAM-Ultimate subscription, which means he has full access to everything Fusion has to offer. By everything Fusion, I mean EVERYTHING FUSION!!!

And yet, he is asking for something not ADSK, and quite possibly not rent-A-software ( SAAS if you will )

Well, so am I!

Since allowing both of my ( Inventor PDSU and FeatureCAM Premium ) licenses expire, I have saved over $8K, only to be put towards to whatever comes next.
My needs are 95% 3+1 milling and 5% full 3D. No 5 axis, no additive, not even 3+2 or mill/turn, even though I have that with my FC-Premium package...
At the same time, I also will need a new CAD platform as well.....

So, in that realm, what - if anything - does NX has to offer?

( Gregor: Sorry to somewhat sidetrack your thread, but we are somewhat in the similar boat !!! )

Yep, we are at least in a similar boat if not the same.

I do want to get rid of featurecam in the long term, because of autodesk. That has been discussed ad nauseum already*

The problem is I haven't found anything that is not a downgrade in some domain. NX CAM has some nice tools that fc doesn't, but is not as fluent in getting from model to code. The more I look, the more it seems like fc is in a league of it's own in that respect. Besides FC, I have used Mastercam, Edgecam, and HSMWorks, but I would not say that I was advanced with any of those packages. I have demoed more.

We have several seats of solidworks for our modelling. I have used NX (CAD, and was proficient with it). Ever since my spell with NX I am constantly frustrated with solidworks, and I want to move to NX for that reason, however I am not convinced that I will be able to produce the same volume of programs in the same time with NX CAM.

I am doing 5ax programming, so the high end features of NX might not be wasted on me, but so far the 5ax functionality of FC has done what I need it to, so that's not a significant + for NX.

I am not convinced that Siemens will continue with perpetual licenses, at least for small scale users. For the big guys, probably yes, but small companies with one or a handful of seats, I strongly suspect will get pushed onto a subscription scheme sooner or later.

I am definitely not looking to switch to CAMWorks (or any other SW integrated CAM). I was just wondering if I could get some utility out of something I already own.

At this point I am at something of a loss as to what I might actually switch to in the long term.

* To add fuel to that fire, since December until recently I was engaged in a protracted argument with AD licensing who accused me of sharing my Named User license with another person, after I installed it on a second machine, as I am supposedly entitled to do. Out of the blue I received a very officious email which stated they had evidence of license misuse, along with a stated deadline by which time I was required to purchase another seat of featurecam, and because my license is a three year subscription, they wanted that again, along with £4k.something in fees for a total of about £25k. I was absolutely enraged, but kept my cool and argued my case calmly and they eventually backed off after I gave them sufficient evidence that it was, in fact, me using it on both machines. I have enough bullshit to deal with everyday without that kind of additional stress, and that is one more nail in ad's coffin for me.

 

[BugRobotics]

Oh man that sucks. Sorry to hear that. I would have spared you and everyone else the eye rolls with the HSMWorks push if I had known.

Autodesk is really on a another level of pissing people off.

 

[gregormarwick]

Oh man that sucks. Sorry to hear that. I would have spared you and everyone else the eye rolls with the HSMWorks push if I had known.

No worries, it was relevant to the topic, if not really relevant to me.

Autodesk is really on a another level of pissing people off.

Yes, they really are. What's crazy is that they seem to not care. A lot of their userbase are (like me) procrastinating about switching because of the pain that entails, but they (AD) don't seem to comprehend that none of their customers are truly captive. I am confident, or at least optimistically hopeful, that they will fuck themselves over eventually.

 

[Marvel]

I am not convinced that Siemens will continue with perpetual licenses, at least for small scale users. For the big guys, probably yes, but small companies with one or a handful of seats, I strongly suspect will get pushed onto a subscription scheme sooner or later.

And yet, he is asking for something not ADSK, and quite possibly not rent-A-software ( SAAS if you will )

Well, so am I!

So, in that realm, what - if anything - does NX has to offer?

I shared this information above already. On 11/15/2021 when I reached out to a reseller for a NX quote and was kind of turned off by the subscription they offered and asked about perpetual licensing, I was told:

After 3 years if you don't renew, the license gets turned off. You still own all your data but you won't have access to the software. It's the same setup if you had a subscription to a CRM or other type of subscription software.

Currently, perpetual licensing is still available. However, we just got back from a Siemens reeducational conference last week and they are moving everything to subscription and it's an uphill battle for any new perpetual licensing. Perpetual licensing will eventually all disappear it's just a matter of when.


Expressing my concern with the subscription I was also told the following:

I completely understand. If you should have any other questions please feel free to reach out to me. If you do want to look at perpetual licensing we can see about it but I would need to work with Siemens on my end.

Which would be what I would want, but am I grandfathered in to my perpetual license or 2 years down the road am I forced into a subscription?

I think Fusion/Autodesk disrupted the CAM industry with their low cost subscription and its only a matter of time before they all offer something similar and I am hoping its just that, something they OFFER for those that want that.

NX is already moving that way, CAMWorks has had subscription based for a couple years now, but I've never noticed it to be pushed by resellers. On a business side I get it, on a user side, for me personally, I hate it. I hate the idea that I invest that amount of money annually for something I never will own outright.

 

[Marvel]

I am definitely not looking to switch to CAMWorks (or any other SW integrated CAM). I was just wondering if I could get some utility out of something I already own.

I think anyone that has experience and is efficient in NX is going to have a tough time moving to any software.

For me having experience with MasterCam, SurfCam and BobCad. IMO I find CAMWorks to be superior to those. The CAD side of the 3 listed above is absolutely terrible and I utilize the CAD side(SolidWorks) of CAMWorks daily. Whereas if I was just strictly a programmer I could probably get by in MasterCam. I have considered MasterCam for SW but I felt the CAM side of CAMWorks being it was the first integrated in SW and is built around SW it integrates better than any of the "add in" CAM options out there. And MasterCam is now ending the SW add in option.

So for me NX would be the only "upgrade" IMO from where I am at to get a good CAD/CAM integrated package. I do like some of what HSMWorks offers and feel it would be relatively a lateral move but I'm not a fan of AD either and what they are doing and am seeing a lot of complaints from users so I'd tread carefully going that route.

I also believe each programmer is different and the "best" is based on themselves individually, every programmer is going to take to software differently. The integration of the licensed toolpaths from ModuleWorks in CAMWorks, Siemens, MasterCam, SolidCAM, SurfCam, the list goes on, changes, they all can be calculating and processing the same tool paths behind the scenes but if its not integrated well and efficiently it can be a terrible experience on an individual basis.

 

[BugRobotics]

I think anyone that has experience and is efficient in NX is going to have a tough time moving to any software.

For me having experience with MasterCam, SurfCam and BobCad. IMO I find CAMWorks to be superior to those. The CAD side of the 3 listed above is absolutely terrible and I utilize the CAD side(SolidWorks) of CAMWorks daily. Whereas if I was just strictly a programmer I could probably get by in MasterCam. I have considered MasterCam for SW but I felt the CAM side of CAMWorks being it was the first integrated in SW and is built around SW it integrates better than any of the "add in" CAM options out there. And MasterCam is now ending the SW add in option.

So for me NX would be the only "upgrade" IMO from where I am at to get a good CAD/CAM integrated package. I do like some of what HSMWorks offers and feel it would be relatively a lateral move but I'm not a fan of AD either and what they are doing and am seeing a lot of complaints from users so I'd tread carefully going that route.

I also believe each programmer is different and the "best" is based on themselves individually, every programmer is going to take to software differently. The integration of the licensed toolpaths from ModuleWorks in CAMWorks, Siemens, MasterCam, SolidCAM, SurfCam, the list goes on, changes, they all can be calculating and processing the same tool paths behind the scenes but if its not integrated well and efficiently it can be a terrible experience on an individual basis.

Mastercam for SolidWorks was an absolute mess about 7 years ago. Unless a radical change I'd steer clear.

 

[Marvel]

Mastercam for SolidWorks was an absolute mess about 7 years ago. Unless a radical change I'd steer clear.

I wouldn't consider MasterCam at this point. I was just more giving a comparison to an alternate CAD/CAM that would allow me to keep SolidWorks but found the add in/integration to not be very good, probably part of the reason MasterCam is ending that option.

I think I've came to the conclusion that I have the best option for me currently and doesn't make sense to make any moves. I have a feeling there's going to be some changes in the next few years within the CAM industry.

 

[Shawnrs]

Yep, we are at least in a similar boat if not the same.

I do want to get rid of featurecam in the long term, because of autodesk. That has been discussed ad nauseum already*

The problem is I haven't found anything that is not a downgrade in some domain. NX CAM has some nice tools that fc doesn't, but is not as fluent in getting from model to code. The more I look, the more it seems like fc is in a league of it's own in that respect. Besides FC, I have used Mastercam, Edgecam, and HSMWorks, but I would not say that I was advanced with any of those packages. I have demoed more.

We have several seats of solidworks for our modelling. I have used NX (CAD, and was proficient with it). Ever since my spell with NX I am constantly frustrated with solidworks, and I want to move to NX for that reason, however I am not convinced that I will be able to produce the same volume of programs in the same time with NX CAM.

I am doing 5ax programming, so the high end features of NX might not be wasted on me, but so far the 5ax functionality of FC has done what I need it to, so that's not a significant + for NX.

I am not convinced that Siemens will continue with perpetual licenses, at least for small scale users. For the big guys, probably yes, but small companies with one or a handful of seats, I strongly suspect will get pushed onto a subscription scheme sooner or later.

I am definitely not looking to switch to CAMWorks (or any other SW integrated CAM). I was just wondering if I could get some utility out of something I already own.

At this point I am at something of a loss as to what I might actually switch to in the long term.

* To add fuel to that fire, since December until recently I was engaged in a protracted argument with AD licensing who accused me of sharing my Named User license with another person, after I installed it on a second machine, as I am supposedly entitled to do. Out of the blue I received a very officious email which stated they had evidence of license misuse, along with a stated deadline by which time I was required to purchase another seat of featurecam, and because my license is a three year subscription, they wanted that again, along with £4k.something in fees for a total of about £25k. I was absolutely enraged, but kept my cool and argued my case calmly and they eventually backed off after I gave them sufficient evidence that it was, in fact, me using it on both machines. I have enough bullshit to deal with everyday without that kind of additional stress, and that is one more nail in ad's coffin for me.

I started out with smartcam and used that for a couple of years and then moved into Edgecam for 8 years. One thing I will say about smartcam and edgecam was building a post processor in either software package was real easy and much better than Camworks. Learning Camworks was easy for some things but very difficult with certain things. Building a good post was hard and difficult. The TechDB was hard to use at first but over time I managed to set it up . One thing I liked about Edgecam was the M-Functions pull down menu. That along gave you a lot of flexibility when programming.

 

[Marvel]

I started out with smartcam and used that for a couple of years and then moved into Edgecam for 8 years. One thing I will say about smartcam and edgecam was building a post processor in either software package was real easy and much better than Camworks. Learning Camworks was easy for some things but very difficult with certain things. Building a good post was hard and difficult. The TechDB was hard to use at first but over time I managed to set it up . One thing I liked about Edgecam was the M-Functions pull down menu. That along gave you a lot of flexibility when programming.

Early on I did some post edits, CAMWorks has two post building/editing software you can use, a more basic beginner option and an advanced editor. I was able to get some basic stuff done in it and I know a couple guys that got really good at it. Fortunately for me I have a good VAR that when I purchased my seat of CAMWorks I negotiated 3 custom posts to be included and my reseller maintains and edits it as long as I continue my annual maintenance at no additional cost for any edits. It's pretty rare but maybe a few times a year I come across something I have to hand edit in, and once I prove out how I want that hand edited code in, I send in my post and they add a switch or drop down for me so I never have to hand edit it again, typically get the post back within a few hours.

I've said it a few times, the TechDB years ago was terrible, if you spent some time and figured it out, you could manage to get it to work properly. This new TechDB format is a lot better.

 

[gkoenig]

So, in that realm, what - if anything - does NX has to offer?

I can't tell you what NX offers you in your environment, but I'll give two examples (of a few) of things it has done that blow me away:

- NX has Synchronous Modeling, which is their name for direct modeling of dumb solids, native, or even 2D geometry. Everyone offers some sort of direct editing tools, but the ones in NX are head and shoulders beyond anyone else. I was working with a team at Intel, and got brought into a Zoom meeting where they were having a huge meeting over about a dozen serious changes a big assembly needed, but the assembly was created by multiple teams, and it was the standard goat rodeo of big team bullshit. I loaded the assembly into NX as a dumb solid, shared my screen, and started knocking each of the changes out while the other team folks were still jabbering about it. It probably knocked a full week of bickering and file trading between the teams to get to the same place.

2- My current project at our camera accessory company are a series of tripod quick disconnect plates that are custom fitted to each model of camera (about 20, with 5-8 added every year as new ones come out). We're using a $2500 desktop scanner who's platform spits out a STL file. We put that STL into NX and use the basic Convergent tools to orient it, then we extract the bottom surfaces our part will hug, and generate a "knockout" shape. We use WAVE links in NX to bring that knockout into a template file where it cuts the base plate design to the camera's bottom profile for the custom fit. More WAVE links spit this geometry into a CAM file that automatically updates all the toolpaths to the custom part.

Right now, I'm at about 2 hours from the time a camera touches the scanner to the Speedio finishing the first article part. Most of that is scan time (about 30 minutes) and extracting the geometry from the STL because I only have NX's basic Convergent Tools. Stepping up to the advanced package would probably cut this down to 90 minutes.

This workflow combine a lot of the NX's feature set to be possible, and I don't think there is another single piece of software that could pull it off. Absolutely not in one package, and not even at NX's high comparative price.

 

[gregormarwick]

I can't tell you what NX offers you in your environment, but I'll give two examples (of a few) of things it has done that blow me away:

- NX has Synchronous Modeling, which is their name for direct modeling of dumb solids, native, or even 2D geometry. Everyone offers some sort of direct editing tools, but the ones in NX are head and shoulders beyond anyone else. I was working with a team at Intel, and got brought into a Zoom meeting where they were having a huge meeting over about a dozen serious changes a big assembly needed, but the assembly was created by multiple teams, and it was the standard goat rodeo of big team bullshit. I loaded the assembly into NX as a dumb solid, shared my screen, and started knocking each of the changes out while the other team folks were still jabbering about it. It probably knocked a full week of bickering and file trading between the teams to get to the same place.

2- My current project at our camera accessory company are a series of tripod quick disconnect plates that are custom fitted to each model of camera (about 20, with 5-8 added every year as new ones come out). We're using a $2500 desktop scanner who's platform spits out a STL file. We put that STL into NX and use the basic Convergent tools to orient it, then we extract the bottom surfaces our part will hug, and generate a "knockout" shape. We use WAVE links in NX to bring that knockout into a template file where it cuts the base plate design to the camera's bottom profile for the custom fit. More WAVE links spit this geometry into a CAM file that automatically updates all the toolpaths to the custom part.

Right now, I'm at about 2 hours from the time a camera touches the scanner to the Speedio finishing the first article part. Most of that is scan time (about 30 minutes) and extracting the geometry from the STL because I only have NX's basic Convergent Tools. Stepping up to the advanced package would probably cut this down to 90 minutes.

This workflow combine a lot of the NX's feature set to be possible, and I don't think there is another single piece of software that could pull it off. Absolutely not in one package, and not even at NX's high comparative price.

Do you have any experience with the CMM module in NX?