EPAIII
Diamond
- Joined
- Nov 23, 2003
- Location
- Beaumont, TX, USA
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Keyless Drill Chuck Runout ~ 0.0015", True or False
- Thread starter EPAIII
- Start date
- Replies 43
- Views 6,680
Mike1974
Diamond
- Joined
- Nov 5, 2014
- Location
- Tampa area
To be really honest, I never use drill chucks on a cnc machine.
ER32 collets are the way to go IMO.
One reason is you can slide the drill up as high as possible for maximum rigidity.
Drill chucks>>>> for drill presses.
I hear alot about not using drill chucks in a cnc... but I don't get it?
We probably have 10 or so in the shop, different brands, all keyless and they always cut on size (drill size). Maybe because they are integral cat40, so no "extra" place (ie arbor in a er collet or set screw holder) for runout...?
EPAIII
Diamond
- Joined
- Nov 23, 2003
- Location
- Beaumont, TX, USA
Seems like all the comments here have not changed my original view on this subject: run-out in a drill chuck is a crap shoot. And even if you pay a premium price, you are not guaranteed any level of accuracy.
After reading the comments about keyless chucks and hole saws I am glad I have keyed chucks on my drill presses. I recently did some work with a hole saw and had a crash that broke the pilot drill. I am sure glad I did not trash a keyless chuck that cost many hundreds of dollars. My keyed, Rohm chuck (<$100) rode it out with no ill effects.
After reading the comments about keyless chucks and hole saws I am glad I have keyed chucks on my drill presses. I recently did some work with a hole saw and had a crash that broke the pilot drill. I am sure glad I did not trash a keyless chuck that cost many hundreds of dollars. My keyed, Rohm chuck (<$100) rode it out with no ill effects.
I hear alot about not using drill chucks in a cnc... but I don't get it?
We probably have 10 or so in the shop, different brands, all keyless and they always cut on size (drill size). Maybe because they are integral cat40, so no "extra" place (ie arbor in a er collet or set screw holder) for runout...?
I use ER collets in our CNCs. Not necessarily for the accuracy but for the price, tool length, and convenience. I have dozens of ER holders just for drills, can't imagine what that would cost to replace them with drill chucks. Possibly two to three times the cost of an ER collet holder and collet.
Terry Keeley
Titanium
- Joined
- Oct 18, 2005
- Location
- Toronto, Canada eh!
Looks like Albrech "guarantees" 0.04mm runout (0.0016").
https://www.albrecht-germany.com/fi...=Albrech_Bohrfutter_EN_ohne_Preise_100217.pdf
Doesn't say where that's taken but if I got one with 0.007" I'd send it back.
https://www.albrecht-germany.com/fi...=Albrech_Bohrfutter_EN_ohne_Preise_100217.pdf
Doesn't say where that's taken but if I got one with 0.007" I'd send it back.
Last edited:
Terry Keeley
Titanium
- Joined
- Oct 18, 2005
- Location
- Toronto, Canada eh!
Gonna order a CP130-2MT (MT2 with integrated shank) tomorrow from Travers, they had the best pricing.
I know my spindle is good so I'll check it and report back.
I know my spindle is good so I'll check it and report back.
Milland
Diamond
- Joined
- Jul 6, 2006
- Location
- Hillsboro, New Hampshire
Really? It looks like it's $488 from Travers, about $442 from Penntoolco.
Albrecht (73010) Keyless Drill Chuck with Integral Shank 1/32"-1/2" 2MT - CP130-2MT - Penn Tool Co., Inc
Conrad Hoffman
Diamond
- Joined
- May 10, 2009
- Location
- Canandaigua, NY, USA
IMO, no matter what you use, you should measure and verify it. I've found just mounting a chuck on a taper adapter isn't as straightforward as you might think. Also, when you tighten a keyed chuck, do you go around and tighten at all three holes? It can make a difference.
It's probably not the way for best run-out but at work we usually mount chucks on a short 1/2" stub adapter. The Bridgeport typically has a 1/2" collet in place, so the chucks and 1/2" end mills can be quickly exchanged. At home I'll use a full R8 adapter because I'm less interested in speed and efficiency.
It's probably not the way for best run-out but at work we usually mount chucks on a short 1/2" stub adapter. The Bridgeport typically has a 1/2" collet in place, so the chucks and 1/2" end mills can be quickly exchanged. At home I'll use a full R8 adapter because I'm less interested in speed and efficiency.
carlherrnstein
Aluminum
- Joined
- Apr 18, 2015
- Location
- Ross County, Ohio
I prefer keyed chucks for drilling and collet holders for reaming. If you want it running true you better indicate and adjust.
Don't get me wrong I like keyless chucks for some things light work, multiple tool changes in a manual and the are quite nice on a cordless drill.
My main complaint about keyless chucks on a machine is they self tighten during use and can be difficult to loosen an they can really bite into the tool shank. At that point who cares what the run out was cause its really bad.
Don't get me wrong I like keyless chucks for some things light work, multiple tool changes in a manual and the are quite nice on a cordless drill.
My main complaint about keyless chucks on a machine is they self tighten during use and can be difficult to loosen an they can really bite into the tool shank. At that point who cares what the run out was cause its really bad.
Terry Keeley
Titanium
- Joined
- Oct 18, 2005
- Location
- Toronto, Canada eh!
Are you looking at the MSRP? I'm seeing $406?
Keyless Drill Chuck With 2MT Shank | 63-005-573 | Travers Tool Co., Inc.
BRAND NEW 1/8" - 5/8" ULTRA HIGH PRECISION KEYLESS DRILL CHUCK R8 R-8 SHANK | eBay
Very HIGH PRECISION, HIGH QUALITY, These are the highest quality drill chucks that you will find out there!
You are looking at a High Precision Keyless Drill Chuck, with a Capacity from 1/8 - 5/8", and has an integrated R8 Shank to fit just about any milling machine that is out there.
It includes the keyless drill chuck, and wrench as shown. These are self tightening drill chucks, with very high gripping power and very low runout, making these the BEST drill chucks out there like this. There is nothing out there better than these drill chucks, they are absolutely top of the line.
Runout on these chucks is +/- .00078, which is almost unheard of in a drill chuck. (Yes, plus or minus less than one thousandth of an inch)
Terry Keeley
Titanium
- Joined
- Oct 18, 2005
- Location
- Toronto, Canada eh!
Doing some reaming lately for dowel pins with a 5/16" reamer and the shank was about 0.290".
Didn't have an MT2 collet to fit and my Jacobs chuck wasn't close to running true...
Milland
Diamond
- Joined
- Jul 6, 2006
- Location
- Hillsboro, New Hampshire
Gotcha. I was reading from a table with other arbor choices, not the specific listing. That's a great price, have at it.
Thunderjet
Stainless
- Joined
- Jun 24, 2019
I have an Albrect 0-1/8 high accuracy keyless that I use for very small holes. It's runout is about .0003. But I take very good care of it and don't let any asshats use it.
I keep it very clean and put it away after every use. It's probably fifteen years old and I've never had a problem with it.
I think they are fine chucks if you treat them properly, and don't drop them on the floor.
I keep it very clean and put it away after every use. It's probably fifteen years old and I've never had a problem with it.
I think they are fine chucks if you treat them properly, and don't drop them on the floor.
Terry Keeley
Titanium
- Joined
- Oct 18, 2005
- Location
- Toronto, Canada eh!
Hmmm...My gut says pass on the "quality import", but?
1/32-1/2 HIGH PRECISION KEYLESS DRILL CHUCK MT2 1/32" - 1/2" CAPACITY | eBay
https://www.precisionmatthews.com/shop/132-12-high-precision-keyless-drill-chuck-mt2/
Obviously made offshore, wonder how accurate that runout figure is?
Also, it doesn't state they are self tightening, including a wrench makes me wonder as well?
Looks like a hand grenade, lol.
edit: the FleeBay ad says self tightening but not their website...
thanks. so tir is 0.0016", right? still not bad. very hard to believe.
I dunno.
I'll say this - any runout that small is, IMO, questionable in that it invokes the question of repeatability. It might do it one time, but will it do it all the time? It doesn't help you much if it's spot on once in a while. That's why when I'm measuring something to a really tight tolerance, as soon as I get the reading I want, I stop measuring. lol.
I'll say this - any runout that small is, IMO, questionable in that it invokes the question of repeatability. It might do it one time, but will it do it all the time? It doesn't help you much if it's spot on once in a while. That's why when I'm measuring something to a really tight tolerance, as soon as I get the reading I want, I stop measuring. lol.
Terry Keeley
Titanium
- Joined
- Oct 18, 2005
- Location
- Toronto, Canada eh!
Meh. I think I'll go with my gut on this one.
I've wanted a nice chuck for a while and I'm sure my German bud Al Brecht won't disappoint.
I've wanted a nice chuck for a while and I'm sure my German bud Al Brecht won't disappoint.
Thunderjet
Stainless
- Joined
- Jun 24, 2019
Sounds like a solid decision.
No hole saws..........K?
And don't scrimp on the spotter you purchase. I hide mine, so nobody else can screw it up. It's the most important tool I own.
