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Making custom hand wheels/dial increments

Deadbolt Don

Plastic
Joined
Nov 15, 2021
Please Help, I over think things WAY to much sometimes.
I have been converting a King Canada cross slide table to ball screws and prepping for stepper motor mounts to go CNC.
In the mean time I need to get hand wheels on the newly installed ball screws. I am trying to reason in my untrained brain if the diameter of the "dial is consequential to one full rotation"? Because the ball screw will ultimately define the travel per full rotation correct?
If I use a larger dial, then the scale needs to be in mm, since my 1605 ball screws are 5mm pitch? Can I just re-label the 0.50" dials I have some how? Or will the .50" actually be useable.
In the end the dual shaft steppers will have wheels & dials but the dials have marking that I don't think I can trust at all.
I should just get a 3 axis DRO for it and be done, but converting to CNC in near future this seems to be a waste of time or money. But for simpler operations it would be nice to not drag the laptop out. Plus the steppers won't show the movement in real time manual mode anyway so maybe it is worth the DRO. First.
 
Don't see what the size of the dial has to do with anything.
For a 5 mm pitch ball screw, the dial should be marked 0-1-2-3-4- for a full revolution, plus all the finer graduations between those.
A larger diameter dial will allow for finer (readable) graduations of course.
 
Thanks Benta!
That is what I thought but like I said I overthink things to the point I confuse myself LOL!! And I am building a mill HAHA.
What is the math to figure out how to get .05 mm increments? Just simply 5/.05=100 lines?
Clearly, Me with a mill is like a donkey with a spinning wheel. Damned if he knows how he got it and damned if he knows how to use it.
 
I'm an advocate for varying the line lengths to make them easier to discern. Rather than 9 the same length, or even 4 the same length if you're making the 5 mark longer, if "1" and "4" are shorter than "2" and "3" it's much easier to figure out exactly where you are without counting over. |illi|illi| rather than |iiiiiiiii|
^ ^

Okay, character spacing didn't work out that well after posting. The carat was supposed to actually point to a place on the scale.
 
Well if you make your own, a shaper is the easiest method.

1656776323144.png

Just do your longest lines first, then the next longest, then the short ones. With the shaper running about 14 to 20 strokes/min, and a longish stroke, it is easy to get comfortable on a stool, and index between hits. If you get lost or uncomfortable, just let the shaper hit twice while you get back in stroke yourself. Then resume the tempo. It goes quite fast.

smt_planerslide38.jpg


The nicest thing about cutting graduations on a shaper is the convenience to stamp them. Just need a broached guide in the shaper tool lantern.
1656776700458.png

1656776733882.png

1656776773395.png

smt
 
Stephen,

Did you find your number stamps pretty consistent for squareness and centeredness? I had to get three sets of numbers and selected the best group, but they're still not great. Some are a little high or low, a little left or right, and leave a deeper impression on one edge or another. I wrote and asked about better numbers for this application and they just suggested the ones that fit in a holder. They're short, rectangular and something like $17 per character several years ago so I passed on that. In the meantime it's just fudge a bit for appearance and hit it again if it's too light on one edge. I'd have to say that when it's all dressed down and polished it looks better, but a discerning eye can still see the variations.
 
@Deadbolt Don what software are you using?

If you put encoders on each axis, you can use them for a dro. They will also be particularly useful in the future when you decide that closed loop motion control is wayyy better. :D

@stephen thomas
That dial looks very nice. Do you have this documented in a thread here somewhere?
 
Not many with a shaper in there shops today, but I've got a smaller one. Using it for the index lines and a DH I'd already thought of. But your mention of also using the lantern tool post to hold, align and then stamp the numbers was a definite forehead slapping moment because of how obvious & clever that idea should have been Stephen. Many thanks.
 
I re-marked the dials for most of the South Bend lathes in my high school shop class about 20 years ago. My old shop teacher asked me to do it so I did. They had a problem in that some of the dials were marked in "diameter" and some in "radius" so he wanted them all the same so the kids wouldn't get screwed up. I turned the old numbers off, then bead blasted the dials. Used a dividing head and corner of an endmill at 45° position of the dial for the lines, then a number stamp jig similar to Stephen's. After that, hard chromed the ODs and filled in the lines and numbers with black paint stick. They're still using them today I'm pretty sure.
 
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Did you find your number stamps pretty consistent for squareness and centeredness? I had to get three sets of numbers and selected the best group, but they're still not great.
These young bros stamps ( have several sets/sizes) were bought new close to 40 yrs ago. I don't know about current product, though i have picked up various older, and at least one import set, in auction odd-lot boxes.

I think i had to stone some burrs off some of them, but they all fit fairly well in a 1/4" square broach, using a minuteman broach. It is necessary to turn that broach 4x to get a true square on size hole, though.

The heights do vary - for combination stamps i set them up and take a pass on the surface grinder. Also, it might be necessary to grind more or less off some sides to get the spacing looking OK. For stamping dials with a ballpein hammer, height does not matter. :)

Bought individual young bros stamps to make this. Aprox 20 yrs ago.
DSCN1436_01.JPGstamp2_01.JPGDSCN1425_01.JPG

Bill said:
Between my 12" Sheldon Shaper and the H.B. Preise Panto-Engraver, the engraver would get that job.

Gorton 3D here & use it.
For dials, the shaper is faster & the lines are cleaner.
Unless you have the unicorn synchronized rotating set up for the panto.

. After that, hard chromed the ODs and filled in the lines and numbers with black paint stick

You arer just plain hardcore! :)
That would sometimes be a great option for steel dials.

Do you have this documented in a thread here somewhere?

Small section, re-scraping toolslide on my planer a few years ago.

Near the bottom, on page 2

Thanks for the nice comments!
smt
 
I have had the same experience with the characters and numbers in the sets. And I am talking about name brand punch sets, not no-name imports.

I took some time to determine the size of shims needed to center each of them.

I made a set of shims in 1-2-4-8 thousands intervals so I can get any whole number I need with a binary combination. The shims are a little less than 1/4" wide and are bent in an "L" so they will sit on the side of the guide hole for the punches.

You actually need to shim the punches on TWO adjacent sides for best alignment (left-right and up-down).



Stephen,

Did you find your number stamps pretty consistent for squareness and centeredness? I had to get three sets of numbers and selected the best group, but they're still not great. Some are a little high or low, a little left or right, and leave a deeper impression on one edge or another. I wrote and asked about better numbers for this application and they just suggested the ones that fit in a holder. They're short, rectangular and something like $17 per character several years ago so I passed on that. In the meantime it's just fudge a bit for appearance and hit it again if it's too light on one edge. I'd have to say that when it's all dressed down and polished it looks better, but a discerning eye can still see the variations.
 
There are other methods of marking a dial in today's world. One that I liked involved printing a scale on a piece of plastic print medium. The scale should be calculated to fit the diameter of the dial PLUS the thickness of the plastic print medium. Then it goes a bit to the left and right of zero on each end and is cut DIAGONALLY across the zero line. This is where the splice will be and the two halves of the zero line should align when it is assembled on the dial. This ensures accuracy. If the zero lines do not align you need to adjust the length of the scale and print it again.

There is a need for protection of the printed characters. This can be done in two ways. First, you can use clear plastic print medium and print the characters in reverse. Then they are installed with the numbers against the dial and the clear plastic protects them from damage. An oil and solvent proof adhesive should be used.

The other way is to print them in the normal manner and use a clear plastic laminated over them. But the laminate may be subject to peeling off due to the oils or other fluids often used in our shops.
 
yes, find an "app" online and print the scale. if this is somehow temporary, you can do it on regular paper, glue it on and give it a clear coat of e.g. nail polish. i got three different ones and picked the one that worked best.
 
App, smap, I just use my CAD program.



yes, find an "app" online and print the scale. if this is somehow temporary, you can do it on regular paper, glue it on and give it a clear coat of e.g. nail polish. i got three different ones and picked the one that worked best.
 
Um, am I missing something here or do we not know how the original dials are marked?

If the original dials have 100 divisions (50 and 200 would also be convenient) all the op has to do divide the thread pitch by the number of divisions to get the new increments. <edit: for 5mm pitch 125 and 250 divisions are also workable >

If they’re convenient increments then only the numbers need to be stamped, right?
 
I have had the same experience with the characters and numbers in the sets. And I am talking about name brand punch sets, not no-name imports.

I took some time to determine the size of shims needed to center each of them.

I made a set of shims in 1-2-4-8 thousands intervals so I can get any whole number I need with a binary combination. The shims are a little less than 1/4" wide and are bent in an "L" so they will sit on the side of the guide hole for the punches.

You actually need to shim the punches on TWO adjacent sides for best alignment (left-right and up-down).
I ended up surface grinding the sides into uniformity for height, etc. Worked great.

Dan
 
Or do what the Chinese lathe manufacturers do......and just leave a gap in the scale.
That is the First and main reason to build a new base for my mini mill. The dials are marked something stupid like .064", combined with the insane amount of backlash one can only hope all they need to do is full passes on a part.
Plus the original slide table has very little travel. It hit the limits within a few days of playing with it. Instant disappointment with my purchase.
 








 
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