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Mazak Quick Slant 30N CAM T4 rescue or retrofit?

Little update with some bad news:
I just turned on the control, checking all power supplies as suddenly the monitor started to spark and flash. I turned as quick as possible the control off but a burned smell was already there... Looks like this monitor died also (another problem on top) :nutter:

I continued without monitor to check all the voltages on the PSU:
+5.05V
+12.02V
-12.08V
+23.88V
I don't have my oscilloscope here right now so can't measure the ripple.
 
you can replace it with LCD one. I saw few available on ebay. It should be coming with little PCB to interface it with Meldas NC monitor output.
 
Those values for your PS appear spot-on, so as '777 suggests, the PS seems to be OK. So time to dive deeper elsewhere...

The monitor is driven by one of the NC rack boards, the FX715 I believe. A bad board can fry a monitor (or two, ask me how I know, haha).

Good luck with it, keep us posted.

ToolCat
 
Hi,

First of all, I wish all of you and your family a very happy and healthy 2023!!

The monitor is driven by one of the NC rack boards, the FX715 I believe. A bad board can fry a monitor (or two, ask me how I know, haha).
As I heard and saw flashes around the tube, I guess the HV system failed on the monitor...
How can a bad board fry the HV system of the monitor? The monitor works with EGA I thought?
The monitor did work before but the brightness was very low, already a sign of giving up.

As for the parity error, are there any other things I can check or replace? I didn't find any FX784 board set for a T4 on ebay yet...
 
Hi,

First of all, I wish all of you and your family a very happy and healthy 2023!!


As I heard and saw flashes around the tube, I guess the HV system failed on the monitor...
How can a bad board fry the HV system of the monitor? The monitor works with EGA I thought?
The monitor did work before but the brightness was very low, already a sign of giving up.

As for the parity error, are there any other things I can check or replace? I didn't find any FX784 board set for a T4 on ebay yet...
have you tried to contact MAZAK Europe to see if they still keep these FX784 boards.
 
As for the parity error, are there any other things I can check or replace? I didn't find any FX784 board set for a T4 on ebay yet...
Accidentally I have complete CNC system rack from CAM T-4... Have to check if there is an FX784 in that pile.
Monitor for MAZAK could be changed to LCD with use of XVGA Box, like I did to my QT15 years ago. Works perfectly although XVGA is a bit expensive (GBS8200 will no work if any... ).
 
have you tried to contact MAZAK Europe to see if they still keep these FX784 boards.
Yes, they gave me also the procedures with the dipswitches to reset the memory.
Now I'm waiting what they say.

Accidentally I have complete CNC system rack from CAM T-4... Have to check if there is an FX784 in that pile.
Monitor for MAZAK could be changed to LCD with use of XVGA Box, like I did to my QT15 years ago. Works perfectly although XVGA is a bit expensive (GBS8200 will no work if any... ).
That would be helpful if you have a replacement board. (y)

For the LCD conversion, I may be thinking of using this system: https://www.aceinnova.com/en/projec...r-x2vga-from-cga-ega-mda-hercules-ttl-to-vga/
I send an email to the vendor. If the price is good, I will give it a try.
 
He has PARITY error. What memory is corrupted? RAM or ROM? if ROM that he cant just swap them.
 
He has PARITY error. What memory is corrupted? RAM or ROM? if ROM that he cant just swap them.
It is the second LED on the board (PE1) so that should be the RAM memory faulty.

I ordered GBS 8219, hopefully I get it soon so we can continue.
 
what amazes me is that none of creators of MAZATROL T2 probably ever thought that people would use this control for almost 40 years. The quality of electronics engineers, Mitsubishi employed at that time, is mind blowing.
 
I received the GBS8219 converter and installed it to the mazak. This is the perfect solution to retrofit a LCD instead of the poor CRT monitor!
Another problem solved.

Only....

I started my machine this morning to test the display. All led lights on the control panel were flickering around. Checked the parameters, they were all gone...
Checked all the batteries, all of them are around 3.7V connected to the board. How can the control lose its parameters with good batteries?

So, back to the beginning.
I did the memory initialization by RS232 with hyperterminal but this looks it doesn't work anymore.
When I switch on the machine with dipswitch 8 toggled, I get the Meldas monitor message in hyperterminal so communication looks OK. After typing the code and switch off the control, the parameters are not 0.
I typed several times the combination for resetting memory but the asterisks and weird parameters are still in the memory...
Only thing that was solved are the led's flickering.

Tried the method with dipswitch 3 several times, no succes...

Are my FX boards completely dead now? :(
 
I removed all boards and drained caps again, reinstalled and now parity led FX784-8 is off??
The weird thing is, I still can't re-initialize memory, not with dipswitch 3, not with hyperterminal...

Tried to adjust parameters. I can change the odd parameter numbers but the even numbers have something strange.
The first bit of all even parameters is 1 and I can't change this.
It looks like the first bit is constantly held high during read/write operation of the memory. Could be a bad chip, pcb track or other short circuit in the board...

Looks like I need a new FX784-8 board I guess.
Can I use a T2, T3 board in my T4 control or maybe a M2?
 
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I can't get this problem out of my head.

Today, I read the YM/YT manual again and found that all parameters are stored on the FX27(727) board and not on the FX784:
Naamloos.png
Looks like maybe I was wrong all the time and I should look at the FX727 board instead of the FX784-8.

Took the board out to recheck it as I already had to repair this board. It is not in very good shape, a lot of beginning corrosion...
Gently cleaned it as it contains a lot of dirt, drained cap, installed battery and board back in the machine.

Here it comes. Powered on, no hydraulics and the ON and OFF button lights at same time.
Unfortunately, parameters still are all crap and still can't change the first bit of the even parameters.

Now comes the question: Did I fried the FX727 board as well or am I right with the only defective board being the FX727?
Yesterday, I tried all kind of things to get it run again but nothing changed.
Today, the only board I touched was the FX727 and now suddenly the hydraulics etc. don't work.

I found a FX727 board and a FX884 board from the same machine on Ebay.
Can this FX884 work on my machine?
 
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I can't get this problem out of my head.

Today, I read the YM/YT manual again and found that all parameters are stored on the FX27(727) board and not on the FX784:
View attachment 384394
Looks like maybe I was wrong all the time and I should look at the FX727 board instead of the FX784-8.

Took the board out to recheck it as I already had to repair this board. It is not in very good shape, a lot of beginning corrosion...
Gently cleaned it as it contains a lot of dirt, drained cap, installed battery and board back in the machine.

Here it comes. Powered on, no hydraulics and the ON and OFF button lights at same time.
Unfortunately, parameters still are all crap and still can't change the first bit of the even parameters.

Now comes the question: Did I fried the FX727 board as well or am I right with the only defective board being the FX727?
Yesterday, I tried all kind of things to get it run again but nothing changed.
Today, the only board I touched was the FX727 and now suddenly the hydraulics etc. don't work.

I found a FX727 board and a FX884 board from the same machine on Ebay.
Can this FX884 work on my machine?
This is insane amount of drama you are going through. Actually we can only access MELDAS manuals and never MAZAKs ones. MAZAK is so secretive organization that I wouldn't be surprised if they were changing a lot while developing MAZATROL, just to make sure MITSUBISHI parts wont be easily interchangeable.

P.S. I used to own BMW E46 , 2002 year, amazing car.. but amount of time I spent trying to fix all issues and oil leaks was insane. Than I sold it and bought old MAZDA 3. Guess what? NO issues at all and all my free time is dedicated to sport, reading books and drinking Japanese beer
 
I received a FX727 board that looked in better shape than mine.
I installed it and wiped memory with hyperterminal. All parameters are 0's now. Looks like this board works(y)

But still a parity error on FX784-8. Tried couples times to reset parity, no luck...
The problem is I can't find a T4B FX784-8 and 784-9 set on ebay to try.
Are there any solutions for this like FX884 retrofit or ROM chip change from my machine?
 
I've got a board set from Ebay of a Mazak Quick Turn lathe.
Installed the backup battery and put it in my machine. No display or startup.
Probably all leds are lit so there's definitely something wrong with the boards/software...

There are a few eprom's in a socket on both boards. Is it safe to change all chips from my original board to the others?
Or do i have to look for a couple of original YT4 boards?
 

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I'm thinking you will need 784-8 & 784-9 boards specifically for the T4...as the "T2" boards will only have 2-axis Mazatrol.

It is possible to carefully swap-out all of the EPROMS on both boards, worth a try maybe?

I wanted to point out in your Post #33 that the early-generation FX04(1) and FX04(2) boards became the FX784-8 & FX784-9 boards. (Which themselves morphed into one FX884 board near the end of the T2/3/4 production.)

Good luck with it, don't give up!

ToolCat
 
Hi there,

It's been a while but I'd like to update the situation about the Mazak.
I didn't solve the problem on the quick slant and I'm not investigating any further for the moment.
The reason is: I followed noname777's advise but i didn't change the brand :D
P.S. I used to own BMW E46 , 2002 year, amazing car.. but amount of time I spent trying to fix all issues and oil leaks was insane. Than I sold it and bought old MAZDA 3. Guess what? NO issues at all and all my free time is dedicated to sport, reading books and drinking Japanese beer

The same company offered me a Quick Turn 20N.
I bought this Mazak, which is working without problems from the first start.
(Just need to adjust the hydraulic pressure because it's too high and need to change the monitor with the LCD + converter i bought)
It's more compact as well for my workshop and it has a hydraulic chuck, which the Quick Slant didn't have.

I also got 4 boxes full of Mazak electronic parts (T2, T3, M2, drives, ...) from the company because it was their last Mazak machine and the maintenance crew needed some space for their own machines.

I don't know what I'm going to do with the Quick Slant right now, maybe I'm going to disassemble it for parts or set it for sale...
Again, I just want to thank you for all the answers by now!
If I could make someone happy with some parts, please let me know by PM

KR, Bart
 
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The older Mazak QT20N's are great machines: box ways, hydraulically-clamped, gear-motor-indexed turrets, gearbox-driven spindles, 2-3/4" bar capable through the spindle, programmable tailstock body and quill, 40" Z travels. These were the last generation of box-way Quick Turns made by Mazak.

(The all-new, linear-guide machines like the QT15 and QT25/28 premiered in 1988).

For the utmost reliability, I recommend slowing down the spindle accel/decel rates, for the FR-SE it is set on the drive itself. And slow down your maximum X and Z rapids a bit ("RF" on X and Z parameter pages).

The drives and motors (and your electrical distribution system in the shop) will thank you....

I have also changed out the turret's gear-motor gearbox, from 30-1 ratio to 50-1, slowing the index speed slightly (less jarring).

Good luck with it!

ToolCat
 
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For the utmost reliability, I recommend slowing down the spindle accel/decel rates, for the FR-SE it is set on the drive itself. And slow down your maximum X and Z rapids a bit ("RF" on X and Z parameter pages).

The drives and motors (and your electrical distribution system in the shop) will thank you....

Good luck with it!

ToolCat
Thanks for the tips!
Is there some manual that describes how to adjust accel/decel ramp on those drives?
I don't have the documentation of the spindle drive...

Maybe I should open a new topic about the QT20, to make it clear to other people ;)
 








 
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