Pratt and Whitney 12” model B vertical shaper

[BKWtoolmaker]

Looking for someone with knowledge of a Pratt and Whitney 12” vertical shaper. I bought one last week that was in good overall condition. The problem is the clutch lever that runs the ram is locked engaged. When I went to view the machine to purchase it was disengaged. Upon startup the machinist Engaged the lever with a very hard pull that I assume locked the clutch. I don’t mind getting into the guts of machines but thought I would put this out there to see if this has happened to anyone else. Today I pulled off the clutch drive plate assembly to see if I could find anything that stood out. Found nothing out of the ordinary. I then proceeded to take off the rear access cover to look in the back of the head. Oil level seems good. There seems to be a sleeve inside that is connected to the friction pulley links. I noticed that the links had been maxed out of travel. I tried slipping a pry bar inside the head and prying slightly against the sleeve while at the same time having another person pull on the lever. I couldn’t get it to move so I decided not to force it. I then removed the bolt on the opposite lever to isolate which side of the machine had the issue. Confirmed it was the clutch side because the other side moved free when separated. I think tomorrow I am going to try and remove the whole main drive pulley/ clutch assembly to see if I can find anything that stands out. Where are all those Pratt and Whitney service guys. Retired probably. I have had many machine tools apart so mechanical aptitude is excellent.

 

[Mike Hill]

The clutch lever goes over center by design to lock the clutch and to unlock you need to give it a firm pull and it should snap out

 

[BKWtoolmaker]

The clutch lever goes over center by design to lock the clutch and to unlock you need to give it a firm pull and it should snap out

Yes I know the clutch goes over center to engage. There must be a way of setting it up so it snaps in easier. You shouldn’t have to force it to disengage or you could brake something inside. I ran one of these identical machines in my younger days and I remember the lever having a light snap. It was also easily disengaged. Thanks for your input

 

[Ohio Mike]

I have its little brother a P&W 6 inch vertical shaper and assume the clutch is the same. They're really simple and that design goes back maybe as far as the 1920s. When I got mine it had a rattle in the clutch and took it apart to diagnose the issue. I cleaned up all the parts and I couldn't see anything wrong. After scratching my head a bit I finally decided to put it back together to further diagnose the issue but to my surprise it worked perfectly fine and no rattle. Maybe its just out of adjustment? Do you have the operators manual with parts list? I have one but its for the 6" model.

 

[BKWtoolmaker]

I have its little brother a P&W 6 inch vertical shaper and assume the clutch is the same. They're really simple and that design goes back maybe as far as the 1920s. When I got mine it had a rattle in the clutch and took it apart to diagnose the issue. I cleaned up all the parts and I couldn't see anything wrong. After scratching my head a bit I finally decided to put it back together to further diagnose the issue but to my surprise it worked perfectly fine and no rattle. Maybe its just out of adjustment? Do you have the operators manual with parts list? I have one but its for the 6" model.

Yes I believe you’re right on the clutch being the same. I have the manual with the cross section views of the mechanical design. I did take apart the clutch plate assembly today to inspect and the only thing I noticed was the plates were a little greasy. Quite normal since it probably hasn’t been taken out apart for many years. Amazingly enough the plates looked like brand new condition. I am pretty sure I have to take the belts off the pulley and use a puller to remove the pulley and inspect the assembly inside that controls the clutch actuation . Not a quick job but I think it has to be done. I did play around with the inner nut that you have to use a pin wrench on. Backed it off and then tried disengaging. Still was very hard . I learned a long time ago if you try and force something mechanical you’re going to most likely brake something inside and then you’re in for a big job .

 

[BKWtoolmaker]

Well figured out what the problem was with my Pratt and Whitney 12” shaper. The lower pin that moves the clutch sleeve was seized. Removed pulley, belt gaurd, a spindle support, and entire clutch assembly. Removed all the old gear oil. Got pin to move . Took everything apart and cleaned in my industrial parts washer. Reinstalled everything and put in brand new oil. I then had to play with the threaded sleeve position inside the back of the machine. Also had to play with the threaded collar position on the end of the pulley . After about an hour finally nailed the position for each so I had engaged, neutral and brake working properly. I don’t think this machine was ever set up properly

 

[johnoder]

Make sure oli is getting pumped upsstairs so both ram ways and internals are getting plently of oil. Letting it just sit in rear reservoir isn't going to do it. If your 12" isn't dribbling oil all over from ram ways, it needs to.

Have manual scanned. Less tham 5Mb. Can be emailed if you want to post that address.

 

[BKWtoolmaker]

Make sure oli is getting pumped upsstairs so both ram ways and internals are getting plently of oil. Letting it just sit in rear reservoir isn't going to do it. If your 12" isn't dribbling oil all over from ram ways, it needs to.

Have manual scanned. Less tham 5Mb. Can be emailed if you want to post that address.

Thanks for that info. I would love to get the manual. [email protected]
The hand pump at the back of the machine. Is that for the ram ways ?

 

[johnoder]

Thanks for that info. I would love to get the manual. [email protected]
The hand pump at the back of the machine. Is that for the ram ways ?

Mine had a Bijur pump left (right from front of machine) rear. You would pump this to put oil up top to get down to stuff by gravity. Out of sight its also filling big screened over "collection trough" to the big linkage working the ram.

If not done yet, get the big curvey sheet metal off back there so you can see something of the guts

 

[BKWtoolmaker]

Mine had a Bijur pump left (right from front of machine) rear. You would pump this to put oil up top to get down to stuff by gravity. Out of sight its also filling big screened over "collection trough" to the big linkage working the ram

I have a new bigur oil pump on an od/id grinder that I am probably going to sell. Think I will take it off prior to selling and save it in case I want to put it on my shaper . Bought a nice chevalier 12/24 od/id grinder. To replace it.

 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Make sure oli is getting pumped upsstairs so both ram ways and internals are getting plently of oil. Letting it just sit in rear reservoir isn't going to do it. If your 12" isn't dribbling oil all over from ram ways, it needs to.

Have manual scanned. Less tham 5Mb. Can be emailed if you want to post that address.

Another vote for having plenty of oil on the ram. I’d rather have oil dripping onto the table than the ram firing up.

Regards Tyrone.

 

[johnoder]

Another vote for having plenty of oil on the ram. I’d rather have oil dripping onto the table than the ram firing up.

Regards Tyrone.

Back in the nineties when Mitchell Machinery was being scrapped (Houston) after old man Mitchell got too sick was a nice looking 6" P&W that had the most horribly grooved ram your ever saw - like it was never oiled, just run to death. It was just thrown in the long line of dumpsters with the rest of the junk.

 

[Tyrone Shoelaces]

Back in the nineties when Mitchell Machinery was being scrapped (Houston) after old man Mitchell got too sick was a nice looking 6" P&W that had the most horribly grooved ram your ever saw - like it was never oiled, just run to death. It was just thrown in the long line of dumpsters with the rest of the junk.

Slotters or vertical shapers are very prone to firing up on the ram. I’ve repaired a few. Gravity is your enemy obviously regarding lubrication. You need to keep that ram well oiled even if it’s dripping on the table or your work piece.

Regards Tyrone.