Pratt & Whitney Gun Manufacture

[Fal Grunt]

I am looking for a copy of Pratt & Whitney's book on gun manufacture. I am uncertain as to the title, I have not seen it yet in published form. Either paper or digital. I am uncertain as to the date of publication, a quote from it leads me to believe very late 1800's to early 1900's.

"Were it possible, within the limits allotted to this work, almost a complete history of the gun industry for the past half century could be written and copiously illustrated with photographs taken from machines, tools and fixtures made by Pratt & Whitney Company and furnished to their customers."

Any help or direction would be appreciated!

 

[johnoder]

They did not make guns to the best of my knowledge - they built every machine needed to do such things - like check out the enormous boring and rifling machines in this 1911 catalog. A related booklet - reprinted by Lindsay - is Accuracy for Seventy Years

Precision tools : Pratt & Whitney Company : Free Download, Borrow, and Streaming : Internet Archive

 

[Fal Grunt]

They did not make guns, in the way that Colt or Winchester made guns, but from my research, each proposal, and each contract, included them producing the specified arm to prove the function of the factory and machinery, as well as allowing inspection and gauging of the completed parts.

 

[johnoder]

Sounds reasonable - wonder how far up the "heavy" road this went - were enormous field pieces so treated ? - P&W sure provided machine tools for such things

 

[trevj]

I am looking for a copy of Pratt & Whitney's book on gun manufacture. I am uncertain as to the title, I have not seen it yet in published form. Either paper or digital. I am uncertain as to the date of publication, a quote from it leads me to believe very late 1800's to early 1900's.

"Were it possible, within the limits allotted to this work, almost a complete history of the gun industry for the past half century could be written and copiously illustrated with photographs taken from machines, tools and fixtures made by Pratt & Whitney Company and furnished to their customers."

Any help or direction would be appreciated!

Was that quote attributed to P&W, or was that simply the author singing the praises of P&W, any idea?

One book that comes to mind is the one on the Springfield Rifle, which goes through the entire manufacturing process in gory detail.

Manufacture of the Model 1903 Springfield Service Rifle, ISBN ‎ 978-0935632200

 

[Fal Grunt]

Was that quote attributed to P&W, or was that simply the author singing the praises of P&W, any idea?

One book that comes to mind is the one on the Springfield Rifle, which goes through the entire manufacturing process in gory detail.

Manufacture of the Model 1903 Springfield Service Rifle, ISBN ‎ 978-0935632200

The quote comes from a collection of documents from an employee of Pratt & Whitney. I have copies of about 900 pages of typed descriptions, and original photographs of machinery, along with a few proposals, estimates, and process sheets. Many of the original prints are the same that can be seen in the 1911 catalog Mr.Oder posted.

One set of documents, about 600 pages, seems to have been roughly organized into what I would call a pre-print proof. This document specifically extolls the merits of P&W's machinery and gauging. The quote comes from this document. I do not know if they actually ever printed this book or not... I was hoping someone, somewhere, had one.

The Springfield book is a good one, I have a digital and paper copy of it. It was an important reference piece when I was setting up to machine 1903 parts. The math that those guys did, by gas lamp light, is beyond impressive.

 

[jlegge]

When I was at Monarch, we got a large order from Remington for barrel turning CNC lathes (Metalists). For a few months our assembly area was full of riffle and shotgun barrels. It was a pretty cool project.

From what I have read about P&W, they made many special machinery for the gun making industry and I believe seeing a reprint of a catalog just for gun makers published around 1900, but I could be mistaken.

John L.

 

[99Panhard]

Pratt & Whitney dominated the market for gun making machines. As an example, when the Germans adopted the M1871 Mauser - the first Mauser designed rifle to be adopted for general issue, they, literally, couldn't make it. P&W received an order to re-equip all of the Prussian State Armories - and order so large that it has been said that the financial panic of 1873 hardly effected Hartford.

Years ago someone posted a photo taken in one of the German armories during WWI...of a line of workmen standing next to P&W rifling machines.

 

[john.k]

Pratt and Whitney won the tender to provide the complete arsenal machinery at Lithgow......won the tender by a few pounds from Greenwood and Batley .....jiggery pokery?......Anyhoo,P&W made a hundred Lee Enfield SMLE MkIII rifles at Hartford to prove the machinery to the DODs satisfaction,then the whole lot was boxed up and shipped to Lithgow........now for a sad story...I had one of the original Lithgow P&W small horizontal mills from 1910.....it was set up as a blade grinder for woodmachining .....took off the near new toolpost grinder,and scrapped the milling machine.

 

[Fal Grunt]

Pratt and Whitney won the tender to provide the complete arsenal machinery at Lithgow......won the tender by a few pounds from Greenwood and Batley .....jiggery pokery?......

I'd be interested to read your source for this, its always funny how different perspectives recall different aspects/facts. The best article on the subject I could find stated that P&W was nearly the same price, for half the machinery. That machinery, would produce 1 rifle every 23 hrs compared to the competitors nearly double that time.

If I can build a factory half the size required by the competitive quote and produce twice the rifles... while the purchase price may be nearly the same, the cost is not even close.

 

[john.k]

I have never read nor even considered the terms of the tender documents ,but far as I know the requirement was for a production capability of so many accepted guns per year.Beyond this ,I only have what has been printed by others......the bare facts of the actual price accepted have never been in dispute.

 

[Blueyaus]

I have been reading a digital copy of a book from the US Navy titled "The Machine Gun" (compiled by George M. Chinn, Lieutenant Colonel, USMCR) which is the 2nd of a 5 volume publication published in 1952.
Here is a quote from page 30 of that book. "Francis A. Pratt was one of the best designers of machine tools. After founding the Pratt & Whitney Co. for manufacturing guns, he found other products so profitable that, today, few people know of the influence of firearms on this outstanding manufacturing concern."
Quite interesting that the American domination of "manufacturing know-how" at the time came largely from the competition of gun producers before the civil war.

 

[john.k]

Not exactly true.....there were a number of English gun machinery makers as well ....Greenwood and Batley,BSA,and the RSAF are three that come to mind.......most of the established machine tool makers also made machines suitable for gun manufacture.

 

[Blueyaus]

Not exactly true.....there were a number of English gun machinery makers as well ....Greenwood and Batley,BSA,and the RSAF are three that come to mind.......most of the established machine tool makers also made machines suitable for gun manufacture.

Hi John, thanks for your correction, my comment was from the book - written by an American.
Cheers.