Production key cutting on shafts......best way?

[IQRaceworks]

I'm trying to find a better/faster way to cut keyways in 1.5" diameter steel shafts.....similar to what you would find on an electric motor shaft.

The way we are currently doing it is with a Bridgeport mill, a v-block type mount on the table, and an endmill cutter. We set it up, cut the keyway on one end of the shaft, unclamp the shaft, flip it around, reclamp, and cut the keyway on the other end. It works, but it's slow. I'm trying to find a way to increase production.....possibly either doing multiple shafts at once (horizonal mill with multiple cutters?), or maybe a CNC mill type setup with multiple shafts clamped to the table at once.

The shaft are around 16"-20" long, and get a keyway cut on each end.

Just looking for some ideas. Thanks!

 

[Booze Daily]

I routinely do it in my VMC with 2 vises. I have 30” in X. Even one at a time is going to be way faster than a BP.

 

[Finegrain]

Any standard CNC mill, even a little 30" x 16" like mine, can do 2 at a time with a pair of standard dual-station vises. A bigger machine could be rigged to do a bunch at a time, but you would need substantial quantities to justify the cost of the fixturing.

 

[memphisjed]

Why flip parts? You can get 30” on a Bridgeport.
2 per clamp, strap clamp with the keyways becoming your v block. The strap has single bolt into center keyway. 2 clamps, one near each end. So two nuts to loosen per 2 parts- fast and easy. Add a nose stop and thinking is removed too.

 

[bigjon61]

It is impossible to offer suggestions because we don't know what equipment you have at hand. Our shop? Cincinnati rise and fall mill if the VMCs are occupied. Set right next to the lathe machining the shafts, the operator can run both. I'm guessing you don't have a Cincinnati rise and fall mill.

 

[TGTool]

Referencing your current setup. The bottleneck for production is more likely the machining time rather than the setup time. Sure, setting up several at once will reduce the setup per part, but the suggestions for two vises, or two places for a shaft on the table would eliminate dead time in setup altogether. That is, one part is being machined while the other fixture is being changed out. Assuming you have at least automatic feed on the mill.

The only other way to increase efficiency is to reduce the machining time. For instance if you are using HSS tooling but could use carbide with faster feeds and speeds. Or if you change to a keyway cutter and machine from the side you'll have more teeth per revolution, and carbide would up that some more.

 

[IQRaceworks]

It is impossible to offer suggestions because we don't know what equipment you have at hand. Our shop? Cincinnati rise and fall mill if the VMCs are occupied. Set right next to the lathe machining the shafts, the operator can run both. I'm guessing you don't have a Cincinnati rise and fall mill.

It's just a older Bridgeport will a power feed on it...pretty basic. We are wanting to knock out 70+ shafts a day.....doing them one at a time just isn't going to cut it. I think something like a Haas VF-2 VMC would do what we are wanting to do....just trying to see if there is something better. We are also dealing with the fact that skilled operators are tough to find......we are having to train people that can't even read a tape measure, let alone a set of calipers. So that adds to the issues....

 

[bigjon61]

It's just a older Bridgeport will a power feed on it...pretty basic. We are wanting to knock out 70+ shafts a day.....doing them one at a time just isn't going to cut it. I think something like a Haas VF-2 VMC would do what we are wanting to do....just trying to see if there is something better. We are also dealing with the fact that skilled operators are tough to find......we are having to train people that can't even read a tape measure, let alone a set of calipers. So that adds to the issues....

Are you looking to purchase a new machine to do these parts? Do you have more parts that would justify such a purchase? Give us the details. CNC would knock these out of the park, but if a $60k VF2 is going to sit there unused, it doesn't make financial sense to buy one.

 

[IQRaceworks]

Are you looking to purchase a new machine to do these parts? Do you have more parts that would justify such a purchase? Give us the details. CNC would knock these out of the park, but if a $60k VF2 is going to sit there unused, it doesn't make financial sense to buy one.

Unfortulaty, whatever machine we get is only going to key shaft....we don't have any other machine work to do on it. The operator is in a work cell where he runs a band saw (to cut the shafts), a lathe (to drill and tap the ends), and the mill (to key the shafts). So it would be nice to have some sort of CNC machine where could load in multiple shafts, hit the GO button, and walk away in order to run the other equipment. I think justification would be pretty easy....just from the fact that we could sell more of the finished product that the shafts go into. Right now the bottle next is the keyway cutting.

 

[macgyver]

Based on the last reply, I think a cnc mill with them filling the table on a dedicated fixture is what you are looking for. Get a 40x20 machine and lay them in the 20" direction so you can fill the whole table left to right. Should give the operator time to get a few centers drilled and tapped. That's probably going to be the next bottle neck once the mill is churning out the keyways reliably.

Probably want a pallet system as well to minimize change over. Being production only with just a couple sizes makes it easier to warrant fancy fixtures, don't have to worry about job shop work going on it too.

 

[604Pook]

Unfortulaty, whatever machine we get is only going to key shaft....we don't have any other machine work to do on it. The operator is in a work cell where he runs a band saw (to cut the shafts), a lathe (to drill and tap the ends), and the mill (to key the shafts). So it would be nice to have some sort of CNC machine where could load in multiple shafts, hit the GO button, and walk away in order to run the other equipment. I think justification would be pretty easy....just from the fact that we could sell more of the finished product that the shafts go into. Right now the bottle next is the keyway cutting.

Manual lathe?

You could run a bar fed CNC lathe with live tooling and get rid of all 3 other machines possibly and only have the operator unloading or loading material.

 

[gregormarwick]

Unfortulaty, whatever machine we get is only going to key shaft....we don't have any other machine work to do on it. The operator is in a work cell where he runs a band saw (to cut the shafts), a lathe (to drill and tap the ends), and the mill (to key the shafts). So it would be nice to have some sort of CNC machine where could load in multiple shafts, hit the GO button, and walk away in order to run the other equipment. I think justification would be pretty easy....just from the fact that we could sell more of the finished product that the shafts go into. Right now the bottle next is the keyway cutting.

If they're already going in a lathe and you're just keying the ends of the shaft, get a live tool lathe and do everything in one op. You'll be looking at a couple of minutes an end that way.

It would be entirely possible to fully automate it with a bar magazine and a sub spindle and some kind of basic automation to unload from the rear of the sub, but for 70pcs a day probably not worth it, unless it's 70pcs a day for the next couple of years...

 

[604Pook]

I am pretty sure @EmGo will pull out a video of a dedicated cnc key way cutting machine that does both shaft ends at the same time...

 

[Matt@RFR]

Manual lathe?

You could run a bar fed CNC lathe with live tooling and get rid of all 3 other machines possibly and only have the operator unloading or loading material.

I'm generally against buying used machines, but this is the perfect application for an old live tool lathe with bar feeder.

IQRaceworks is going to look like an absolute hero if he can implement this. Better buy your cape now.

 

[dkmc]

Clamp it to the table with it setting in the T slot for alignment. Use a stop. Use Kopal clamps instead of step clamps to speed things up. And use a Woodruff cutter instead of an end mill.

Oh 70 pcs per day. Then you need a Kent Owens production mill, similar setup as above.

 

[EmGo]

I am pretty sure @EmGo will pull out a video of a dedicated cnc key way cutting machine that does both shaft ends at the same time...

for 70 pcs/day ? no .... live spindle lathe sounds good but probaly more money than he needs to spend. Cheapest vmc he can find would probably be fine. Hurco KMB-1 would do that job fine and cost almost nothing.

 

[kb0thn]

30 year old Mazak SQT15. $5k. Face, chamfer, spot, drill, tap, mill key. Two or three minutes. Program on the control. Pay somebody those knows the old Mazaks to set it up for you and show you how to make adjustments. Now you just band saw and load and flip parts. Maintenance changes tools once a day.

 

[kb0thn]

Or get a moving column VMC and pop some clearance holes through the table. Put a chuck or a pneumatic collet closer above hole. Now you can have the VMC clean up the end and tap the hole as well. Nice part about the VMC versus the lathe is that it has more tool pockets so you can probably have it automatically switch tool numbers when a tool is likely used up.

 

[pcd]

@IQRaceworks Are all the keyways identical? Or is there a mix of lengths or widths?

 

[gbent]

Dkmc has it. Get rid of the end mill and use a wheel cutter as large as your runout area will allow.

What is your budget? Lots of ways to skin this cat.