Small Shop Contract Advice

[Fal Grunt]

I'd appreciate some input from you guys that are small one man shops who have contract work. I have been working to grow my business and bring on a few new customers primarily with repeat, contract type work. It's going to be a bit of a niche since I don't want 10k pc orders, but I need to diversify out of the 1pc, 2pc, 5pc market. I need jobs that I can setup in the Brother, and when I have an hour, turn the machine on and make a pile of parts.

I have run into what I consider is a bit of an odd problem. I know there are a bunch of guys on here that are 1 man shops with contracts. I have had 2 companies tell me that they can't/won't contract to a small shop. The third was ambiguous and didn't REALLY say why, but that was the implication that I got.

I'll use what I think is the weirdest one as an example. I bought one of this companies products, and it had quality issues so I sent it back. During the return process I mentioned to the guy I talked to on the phone that I had a machine shop, and if they were having supplier issues, I'd be interested in talking to someone to see if I could help. They are not a huge company(they are quite large), or the guy actually cared about his work, low and behold a week or two later I get a phone call from the head of their machine shop. We talked for awhile about my capabilities and background and the issues they were having. I was pretty up front about not being able to handle the volume they needed but I was confident I could meet their quality requirements. After talking about my capabilities the part they thought would be a good fit for me required 8000 pcs a MONTH. No way in hell could I supply that. The guy in charge of the machine shop said that is OK, we just need some that we know are good every month. 25-50% of their current suppliers parts were failing inspection. How the F&*( is that possible?!

So the guy in charge of the machine shop was thrilled and we made plans over the phone that they would send over a few of their most troublesome parts for me to look at and quote. I'd run a small batch for them to see my work and then look at larger long term contracts. Except I never heard from them. A couple months later I called back the head of the machine shop and got a short, but polite explanation that "they looked you up, and saw you were a pole building behind your house and immediately said no."

On one hand I get it... If I drop dead tomorrow, they loose a supplier and are caught holding the bag. If you are in a similar situation how do you handle it?

 

[Garwood]

How would you categorize your sales ability?

I've had similar experiences- Not getting work and being told or figuring the reason must have been my backyard shop.

I haven't had that problem in a long time though. I'm straight up about my backyard shop. I think my ability to sell myself and cement a deal has improved and that's what made the difference.

Not saying that is the case in your situation. But it might be easier to look into upping your sales game than moving into an industrial space.

 

[Doug]

How would you categorize your sales ability?

I've had similar experiences- Not getting work and being told or figuring the reason must have been my backyard shop.

I haven't had that problem in a long time though. I'm straight up about my backyard shop. I think my ability to sell myself and cement a deal has improved and that's what made the difference.

Not saying that is the case in your situation. But it might be easier to look into upping your sales game than moving into an industrial space.

If you think about it.. one man shop. You get covid the customer is without a supplier. I did lots of profitable 1 or 2 quantity prototype parts for Boeing. The Boeing engineers they preferred dealing with small shops because they might be talking with the person who might be doing the machining, it made design changes easy and less formal than with big shops. They explained to me the long term contracts only went to companies with a minimum of 7 machinists. It was too risky for them to depend on small vendors.

Another issue can be certifications and liability insurance. A friend bought the small, mom and pop, job shop he worked for. The small shop had been grandfathered into their biggest customer. Unfortunately the big customer treated the new owner like a new vendor requiring mega insurance among other things. End of the small shop after loss of their biggest customer.

I visited a friend's two man shop the other day. I asked how business was..... great he says. Because the majority of the smallish shops in the area are gone due to retirements, high overhead from soaring real estate, buy outs by large shops and other reasons. So he's capitalizing on his ability to do quick turnaround on $mall quantity work.

A plus for me being a small shop (I usually had one or two employees) was I didn't need the super fast, high dollar equipment with all the bells and whistles needed to win competitive contract awards.

Anyway, the bottom line is do what you can do best. And, that's probably onesies and twosies.

 

[Ox]

I'd appreciate some input from you guys that are small one man shops who have contract work. I have been working to grow my business and bring on a few new customers primarily with repeat, contract type work. It's going to be a bit of a niche since I don't want 10k pc orders, but I need to diversify out of the 1pc, 2pc, 5pc market. I need jobs that I can setup in the Brother, and when I have an hour, turn the machine on and make a pile of parts.

I have run into what I consider is a bit of an odd problem. I know there are a bunch of guys on here that are 1 man shops with contracts. I have had 2 companies tell me that they can't/won't contract to a small shop. The third was ambiguous and didn't REALLY say why, but that was the implication that I got.

I'll use what I think is the weirdest one as an example. I bought one of this companies products, and it had quality issues so I sent it back. During the return process I mentioned to the guy I talked to on the phone that I had a machine shop, and if they were having supplier issues, I'd be interested in talking to someone to see if I could help. They are not a huge company(they are quite large), or the guy actually cared about his work, low and behold a week or two later I get a phone call from the head of their machine shop. We talked for awhile about my capabilities and background and the issues they were having. I was pretty up front about not being able to handle the volume they needed but I was confident I could meet their quality requirements. After talking about my capabilities the part they thought would be a good fit for me required 8000 pcs a MONTH. No way in hell could I supply that. The guy in charge of the machine shop said that is OK, we just need some that we know are good every month. 25-50% of their current suppliers parts were failing inspection. How the F&*( is that possible?!

So the guy in charge of the machine shop was thrilled and we made plans over the phone that they would send over a few of their most troublesome parts for me to look at and quote. I'd run a small batch for them to see my work and then look at larger long term contracts. Except I never heard from them. A couple months later I called back the head of the machine shop and got a short, but polite explanation that "they looked you up, and saw you were a pole building behind your house and immediately said no."

On one hand I get it... If I drop dead tomorrow, they loose a supplier and are caught holding the bag. If you are in a similar situation how do you handle it?

Find another door to knock on. The whole bloody world is all of a sudden short handed in general, and the advent of CNC hitting the floors hard by the early 90's means that there are very few actual "machinists" under 50 yrs old, and so with the big retirement party of 2020 we are in VERY short supply!

There has GOT to be several facilities that would be happy to send you work!

Fortunately I was well established prior to Google Earth, but I doo feel that it has been an issue in the more recent years, and I am hoping to edit that situation one of these days, but ... that better happen soon, or it won't be worth it anymore. (ageing gracefully)


--------------------

Think Snow Eh!
Ox

 

[Covenant MFG]

I'm kinda in the same boat, haven't had people who freak out really but got some loads of bigger contracts with the guys.

First: create a solid relationship on the onesies and twosies: cement in their minds that small shops are easier to work with relationship wise.
Trick is to figure out exactly who's butt you're saving when you do the parts for them. Had a job a while back where the engineer was new at the company and in charge of improving the assembly flow, and his pet project for assembly equipment needed to get done FAST to be put in use. They have an in-house machine shop but are about a year behind schedule and the guy didn't have enough weight to prioritize his parts on the shop schedule. A friend hooked me up with him and I got the parts done in about a week, put the dude in good favor with his boss and no enemies internally by changing their schedule.
And, when that new engineer screwed up a feature on the print and found out his mistake later during assembly, he called me directly and I had it reworked overnight with no extra charge. The engineer moved to a different company later but this customer is still a regular.

Second, don't show or post anything that shows how small of a setup you've got. DO not lie or mislead, (your conscience as well as if they find out, your reputation is ruined and bye bye business) but there's no reason to show that you're in the starting stages as long as it's not relevant to promises you've made.

What I've done is "we're a younger shop, in our first year or two of business, done XYZ and we're limited in the volume we can take on because we specialize in quick turnaround right now". If you add a note like "we're looking to move into more volume work in the future but not right now" that sets expectations while leaving the door open for them to throw more work at you if you can handle it. If I'm overwhelmed by volume I'll tell them so, and often add the note that "we have obligations to other customers that we can't reneg on" (as long as that's true). This keeps you from being a captive shop, shows them that you have A: other customers so you're not a nobody, and B: no matter who you make a contract with you keep it. Like the old idea of if a girl is willing to cheat on her boyfriend for you, she'll cheat on you too.

THEN if they're aware you're in small shop underdog mode and they still say no, wipe your shoes and move on. If they send RFQ's later, quote with the expectation that they're very likely to be a beaurocratic nightmare.

 

[Fal Grunt]

How would you categorize your sales ability?

..... But it might be easier to look into upping your sales game than moving into an industrial space.

I would categorize it as mild to moderate. I loathe salesman. I can count on one finger the number of salesman that I have dealt with that I consider honest, upfront, and dependable, ie, not full of shit.

There in lies the problem. I don't promise anything I can't do. I don't state lead times I can't meet. I don't do work that has tolerances I can't hit. If I have concerns about the part, design, features, I ask questions and for clarifications. I've talked customers OUT of giving me work because I wasn't a good fit and recommended them somewhere else to go.

I'm not aggressive in the least, and maybe I should be more aggressive. I had a customer contact me about making another batch of parts I made last year. I responded to his email, twice. I left two voicemails. Never got a reply. I've moved on. If they want the parts made, they'll get back to me.

Anyway, the bottom line is do what you can do best. And, that's probably onesies and twosies.

The market is telling me that I am not good at onesies and twosies. I know that because I am getting less and less of this work. I did a batch of parts for a customer recently, they were very happy with the quality of the work, turn around (6 business days from receipt of material), and price. We even traded a few emails about more work. They wanted to "integrate" me into their quoting processes essentially meaning that all the work they quoted, I would be doing the machining for. They backed me into a corner and told me I had to give them an hourly rate. I told them $100/hr. I have never heard from them again. These are all plus minus .001 parts, typically all one off, special tooling, pain in the butt designs, pain in the butt materials, etc etc.

There is plenty of work out there... I just don't want it. The Tier 1 manufacturer I used to work for has plenty of work. Complex parts pay about $35/hr based on their time estimates. With 90-120 payment terms.

I discussed another job with a local company that they had quoted from another company. Problem was lead time. They wanted them faster. Based on the other companies quote, and based on my BROTHERS speed, the other company was charging about $24/hr. With $0 in tooling, setup charges, workholding, etc.

Find another door to knock on. The whole bloody world is all of a sudden short handed in general, and the advent of CNC hitting the floors hard by the early 90's means that there are very few actual "machinists" under 50 yrs old, and so with the big retirement party of 2020 we are in VERY short supply!

There has GOT to be several facilities that would be happy to send you work!

Fortunately I was well established prior to Google Earth, but I doo feel that it has been an issue in the more recent years, and I am hoping to edit that situation one of these days, but ... that better happen soon, or it won't be worth it anymore. (ageing gracefully)


--------------------

Think Snow Eh!
Ox

I am sure they are out there. I know there has to be. Finding them has been the problem. More than that is getting in through the bureaucratic BS to the people who know what is needed.

Another instance I had a company north of me ask to quote some parts. One of my best friends works there and told them to call me to do the parts. Basically they didn't have time to do them in house. They told me that my price was 3 times what they make them in house for. My friend told me that is TOTAL BS, because they only track the time the part is being machined on the 5 axis (totally unnecessary for the part) and none of the time it is in a manual mill, lathe, 3-axis, or surface grinder. They also don't "account" for the cost of any tooling, setup time, etc. Since he has made the parts in house, he argued that their cost is/would be HIGHER than mine.

 

[Ox]

I'm kinda in the same boat, haven't had people who freak out really but got some loads of bigger contracts with the guys.

First: create a solid relationship on the onesies and twosies: cement in their minds that small shops are easier to work with relationship wise.
Trick is to figure out exactly who's butt you're saving when you do the parts for them. Had a job a while back where the engineer was new at the company and in charge of improving the assembly flow, and his pet project for assembly equipment needed to get done FAST to be put in use. They have an in-house machine shop but are about a year behind schedule and the guy didn't have enough weight to prioritize his parts on the shop schedule. A friend hooked me up with him and I got the parts done in about a week, put the dude in good favor with his boss and no enemies internally by changing their schedule.
And, when that new engineer screwed up a feature on the print and found out his mistake later during assembly, he called me directly and I had it reworked overnight with no extra charge. The engineer moved to a different company later but this customer is still a regular.

Second, don't show or post anything that shows how small of a setup you've got. DO not lie or mislead, (your conscience as well as if they find out, your reputation is ruined and bye bye business) but there's no reason to show that you're in the starting stages as long as it's not relevant to promises you've made.

What I've done is "we're a younger shop, in our first year or two of business, done XYZ and we're limited in the volume we can take on because we specialize in quick turnaround right now". If you add a note like "we're looking to move into more volume work in the future but not right now" that sets expectations while leaving the door open for them to throw more work at you if you can handle it. If I'm overwhelmed by volume I'll tell them so, and often add the note that "we have obligations to other customers that we can't reneg on" (as long as that's true). This keeps you from being a captive shop, shows them that you have A: other customers so you're not a nobody, and B: no matter who you make a contract with you keep it. Like the old idea of if a girl is willing to cheat on her boyfriend for you, she'll cheat on you too.

THEN if they're aware you're in small shop underdog mode and they still say no, wipe your shoes and move on. If they send RFQ's later, quote with the expectation that they're very likely to be a beaurocratic nightmare.

One place to start on this is to accept what payment terms that they offer. Maybe you adjust your pricing accordingly, but being a royal PITA about payment terms is NOT a way to nurse a relationship with a customer - unless they have proven themselves unreliable in the past and you are willing to lose them if they don't comply.

You can be right all day long, but being right doesn't pay the bills.


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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

 

[Fal Grunt]

One place to start on this is to accept what payment terms that they offer. Maybe you adjust your pricing accordingly, but being a royal PITA about payment terms is NOT a way to nurse a relationship with a customer - unless they have proven themselves unreliable in the past and you are willing to lose them if they don't comply.

You can be right all day long, but being right doesn't pay the bills.


-----------------

Think Snow Eh!
Ox

Well said...

I've tried to loosen up on payment terms the last couple new customers. In fact I have 2 new customers I did work for that I am anxiously waiting to see how they follow through with payment.

 

[alliancefab]

I ran into this a lot especially when I stated my shop because I was young (23 then 35 now) I have had purchasing agents be extremely blunt about being small one actually said "if your killed in a car crash what happens to our open POs and parts that are running" they actually became a good customer for a few years till they got sold. I do work for some big companies that have done site visits some didn't like my shop is in an ag area and not an industrial park some don't care. Most of this has gone away at this point due to word of mouth of engineers I've worked with they move on to a new job and I get calls from them.
Oddly enough my equipment list and inspection list on my terrible website actually got some of the companies that were apprehensive to do a site visit to show up and they told me that. worth a shot I guess

 

[Fal Grunt]

I ran into this a lot especially when I stated my shop because I was young (23 then 35 now) I have had purchasing agents be extremely blunt about being small one actually said "if your killed in a car crash what happens to our open POs and parts that are running" they actually became a good customer for a few years till they got sold. I do work for some big companies that have done site visits some didn't like my shop is in an ag area and not an industrial park some don't care. Most of this has gone away at this point due to word of mouth of engineers I've worked with they move on to a new job and I get calls from them.
Oddly enough my equipment list and inspection list on my terrible website actually got some of the companies that were apprehensive to do a site visit to show up and they told me that. worth a shot I guess

I've been avoiding a website due to all the unwanted attention it brings. My experience with websites tends to get a lot of traffic, with very little follow through. Lots of tire kickers, interested parties, irrelevant questions, etc. I talked with an advertising/marketing firm once about a website that I was working on (past life) and it has a 4% conversion rate. That is 4% of people that visited the website bought something. They told me that was extremely good. In my head that means 96 emails for 4 sales. To me that is terrible.

So far any customer that has been to the shop has been impressed, though that hasn't always meant that I got the work we discussed. I probably only quote half the RFQ's I get, but I would guess I get 90% of the work I quote. To me the website would certainly open up more work, but I would have to figure out a way to weed out the stuff I don't want.

 

[Freedommachine]

I am sure they are out there. I know there has to be. Finding them has been the problem. More than that is getting in through the bureaucratic BS to the people who know what is needed.

I brought this up in another thread but I never got an answer.


To everyone who advises that knocking on doors to get work from large companies is the way to succeed; could you please explain the process?

Do you mean literally walk in - past the "No Soliciting" sign - and say to the lady behind the desk; "Hi, my name's Freedom and I would like to become your new favorite vendor"? It's a genuine question, I'm not being facetious.

Full disclosure; I have never tried it but I am skeptical the result would be much more than a little social embarrassment.

I have gotten work from new vendors though. The dynamic is different when I'm the one walking in with a check book in hand. All of a sudden they want to know where I'm from, what I do, what machines I have, ect.

It's a shame that job didn't work out for you Fal. What I don't quite understand is their willingness to just write you off. Especially after you took the time to approach them about their quality issues and offer a solution.

Honesty is always important but I think we can all admit "don't ask, don't tell" and "less is more" can be our most valuable sales tools from time to time.

Have you ever considered leveraging the capacity of other shops in order to meet the needs of a large contract?

A small network of shops who all trust each other enough to take on surplus work load means that everyone wins including the customer (who doesn't know because they didn't ask) .

If one guy blows up a spindle, gets the wooflu, hurricane knocks out power or whatever, the customer still gets the majority of their parts on time and the remaining quantity can be split and caught up quickly.

If you can leverage the capacity of two or three other 1-2 man shops and they do the same for you whenever they have the need, it would be a lot easier to take on bigger contracts with confidence. That's my theory at least.

As for getting burned by Google maps... If you have your accountant as the registered agent of the business and a p.o. box mailing address, it limits your exposure. This way if someone wants to know about your physical location, they will have to ask.

 

[Ox]

I brought this up in another thread but I never got an answer.


To everyone who advises that knocking on doors to get work from large companies is the way to succeed; could you please explain the process?

Do you mean literally walk in - past the "No Soliciting" sign - and say to the lady behind the desk; "Hi, my name's Freedom and I would like to become your new favorite vendor"? It's a genuine question, I'm not being facetious.

Full disclosure; I have never tried it but I am skeptical the result would be much more than a little social embarrassment.

I have gotten work from new vendors though. The dynamic is different when I'm the one walking in with a check book in hand. All of a sudden they want to know where I'm from, what I do, what machines I have, ect.

It's a shame that job didn't work out for you Fal. What I don't quite understand is their willingness to just write you off. Especially after you took the time to approach them about their quality issues and offer a solution.

Honesty is always important but I think we can all admit "don't ask, don't tell" and "less is more" can be our most valuable sales tools from time to time.

Have you ever considered leveraging the capacity of other shops in order to meet the needs of a large contract?

A small network of shops who all trust each other enough to take on surplus work load means that everyone wins including the customer (who doesn't know because they didn't ask) .

If one guy blows up a spindle, gets the wooflu, hurricane knocks out power or whatever, the customer still gets the majority of their parts on time and the remaining quantity can be split and caught up quickly.

If you can leverage the capacity of two or three other 1-2 man shops and they do the same for you whenever they have the need, it would be a lot easier to take on bigger contracts with confidence. That's my theory at least.

As for getting burned by Google maps... If you have your accountant as the registered agent of the business and a p.o. box mailing address, it limits your exposure. This way if someone wants to know about your physical location, they will have to ask.

I have to think that _ that "No solicitors" sign may have been from a past life as well.
There was a time when they weren't looking for more help nor suppliers.
But times are now that they can't git the hep that they want, and there's more work than hep, so everyone either needs to turn work away, or find a nother source.

Not that I have knocked on any doors - well, ever I guess that I can think of.
When I was actually slowed up at times, I just knew that "this too will pass" and that if I tried to find too many new customers now, that I will be over-ran when things pick back up, and I will then piss off my regular customers.

Word of mouth mostly for me I guess.

A buyer or whatnot at one customer would recommend us to other shops around when they were looking for sumpthing.

I have advertised in Thomas for the last many years. Not sure jist how much ever came from it? A few good possibilities, nothing of any size. Likely not enough to even make the Thomas fees. I pulled that ad, and I will drop off their list soon as Xometry bought them, and that seems like a conflict of interest to me...

I brought this up in another thread but I never got an answer.

BTW - that's jist b/c we like Grunt better is all...



----------------

Think Snow Eh!
Ox

 

[Ox]

I've been avoiding a website due to all the unwanted attention it brings. My experience with websites tends to get a lot of traffic, with very little follow through. Lots of tire kickers, interested parties, irrelevant questions, etc. I talked with an advertising/marketing firm once about a website that I was working on (past life) and it has a 4% conversion rate. That is 4% of people that visited the website bought something. They told me that was extremely good. In my head that means 96 emails for 4 sales. To me that is terrible.

So far any customer that has been to the shop has been impressed, though that hasn't always meant that I got the work we discussed. I probably only quote half the RFQ's I get, but I would guess I get 90% of the work I quote. To me the website would certainly open up more work, but I would have to figure out a way to weed out the stuff I don't want.

I have a site. Just sumpthing simple that I built on the generic platform of the host, back during The Crash when I had time. It doesn't git much traffic, and it's not intended to. I don't want Tom's Harry Dick pulling me up on Google every time they need lawnmower blades sharpened. But if someone googles me (there's only two of me in the world) or my business specifically, my site pops up. Or I can direct folks to it, or it's on my card, if I happen to give one to you, but that would likely require me to not be here at the shop, so that doesn't happen often...

I don't get much unwanted traffic. But it's a place that I can show parts, capacity's, maybe even a wee bit'o history... I don't git overly specific in regards to equipment. Name brands and max capacities is about all I offer.


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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

 

[Ox]

In Re; to your "running solo concerns".

First off, your shop is a "we" shop. If that means that you have to refer to Mrs. Grunt as the other to make plural, so be it. You are a "we" shop. Stop using "I" when talking to potential customers, or even long distance customers.

One customer that I have from long distance - I very well may have gotten via Thomas, or maybe just Google? Who knows eh? Anyhow, we ("we") run some parts for them currently, and I quoted (I is OK in this context) some BIG jobs that Big Corp is hoping to bring home from China (as I understand). This would require several new employees and my absence could really put the hurts to Big Corp for some time in this case, and so I expected that if we were to ever land that type job, that I would be looking for "that person" that could oversee the whole deal. Not really someone that can get it going, but someone that knows enough, or can learn enough - who can keep it going.

So, in a bigger case, that is a very real concern, especially if you are one that is not healthy. I had Wuhan Institute for Biological Warfare Flu twice so far, and I have missed 1 day from it. I may not have been worth 2 Shiites for a few other days, but I WAS HERE! I know plenty of folks who miss more work in a year than I have in my life. But that's me...

I've had my shingle up for <35 years now tho.


-----------------------

Think Snow Eh!
Ox

 

[Fal Grunt]

I brought this up in another thread but I never got an answer.


To everyone who advises that knocking on doors to get work from large companies is the way to succeed; could you please explain the process?

Do you mean literally walk in - past the "No Soliciting" sign - and say to the lady behind the desk; "Hi, my name's Freedom and I would like to become your new favorite vendor"? It's a genuine question, I'm not being facetious.

Full disclosure; I have never tried it but I am skeptical the result would be much more than a little social embarrassment.

I have gotten work from new vendors though. The dynamic is different when I'm the one walking in with a check book in hand. All of a sudden they want to know where I'm from, what I do, what machines I have, ect.

It's a shame that job didn't work out for you Fal. What I don't quite understand is their willingness to just write you off. Especially after you took the time to approach them about their quality issues and offer a solution.

Honesty is always important but I think we can all admit "don't ask, don't tell" and "less is more" can be our most valuable sales tools from time to time.

Have you ever considered leveraging the capacity of other shops in order to meet the needs of a large contract?

A small network of shops who all trust each other enough to take on surplus work load means that everyone wins including the customer (who doesn't know because they didn't ask) .

If one guy blows up a spindle, gets the wooflu, hurricane knocks out power or whatever, the customer still gets the majority of their parts on time and the remaining quantity can be split and caught up quickly.

If you can leverage the capacity of two or three other 1-2 man shops and they do the same for you whenever they have the need, it would be a lot easier to take on bigger contracts with confidence. That's my theory at least.

As for getting burned by Google maps... If you have your accountant as the registered agent of the business and a p.o. box mailing address, it limits your exposure. This way if someone wants to know about your physical location, they will have to ask.

Good points for sure. If I have learned one thing in life, whenever someone gives me advise on how to do something, I ask them to give me an example where they did that. Sometimes they falter and backtrack. I am not a "cold call" type person, because I get so frustrated with people who don't care about their job or are mired in the bureaucracy.

I'm not sure why the wrote me off in that way especially since the head of the machine shop and I hit it off so well. They have their corporate policies I guess....

In regards to the google maps, unfortunately when I started my company I filed the paper work myself. So I can make my lawyer or accountant my registered agent, but it will still show my past information on the states website. It's a bummer, but it can't be changed.

I have to think that _ that "No solicitors" sign may have been from a past life as well.
There was a time when they weren't looking for more help nor suppliers.
But times are now that they can't git the hep that they want, and there's more work than hep, so everyone either needs to turn work away, or find a nother source.

Not that I have knocked on any doors - well, ever I guess that I can think of.
When I was actually slowed up at times, I just knew that "this too will pass" and that if I tried to find too many new customers now, that I will be over-ran when things pick back up, and I will then piss off my regular customers.

Word of mouth mostly for me I guess.

A buyer or whatnot at one customer would recommend us to other shops around when they were looking for sumpthing.

I have advertised in Thomas for the last many years. Not sure jist how much ever came from it? A few good possibilities, nothing of any size. Likely not enough to even make the Thomas fees. I pulled that ad, and I will drop off their list soon as Xometry bought them, and that seems like a conflict of interest to me...






BTW - that's jist b/c we like Grunt better is all...



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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

Ha!

Word of mouth has worked so far, but it's been slow.

Good points as well about the "we" and "I". Though I got caught once with a customer when I said we and they asked who is "we". I sheepishly laughed and said my wife and my son and daughter. They smiled and we carried on our conversation.

 

[Ox]

"We"

Now I understand that extra bodies rummaging around in your shop when a potential customer stops in may actually be a bad thing (Grunt is sorta ... tight) but in general, if you know someone is coming in for a spot check, maybe you have a cpl folks that work off shifts or they are a retired neighbor that helps you out from time to time - call those guys up and ask them to come in and look busy, and like they know what they are dooing while this guy's here...

And I don't see this as a lie either... If these guys are here today, if you git ina pickle, these guys would/could be there to help with a real job, so ...


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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

 

[triumph406]

I don't have customers come to the shop, nobody gets passed the front door, or rollup door. Neighbour Jim is always welcome inside, when he comes in it's because he wants to go for lunch, needs a hand, has some cake or something sweet** to share.

Now I have a customer who I've ended becoming the sucker who bids and makes the stuff that nobody wants to make, or makes stuff in a couple of weeks where everybody else is at 4-8 weeks.
Well the last time I was delivering some parts, the young engineer says "we plan on making a visit to your shop to see your capabilities"
I'm thinking f', last thing I need. It'll take a long weekend to make it moderatly presentable. I'd have to sort out the material racks, clean the bathroom etc etc.
Well Plan B, I have a friend who has a largish shop up in Compton. I talked to him and asked if I could use his shop for the visit, He said yes no problem. The downside though will be when they see the 5-axis machine they'll be designing even more parts that are hard to make. Of course when I tell them the shop is in Compton (and not the best part), they might change their minds.

**edit, I didn't mean sweet to share as in pictures of kittens or puppies etc, meant donuts champarada etc

 

[LOTT]

I'd say a website that shows off parts and neglects to list an address is your friend. Someone can still look you up through the state paperwork, but that's an order of magnitude more work than right-click-and-search a street number. Pure speculation, but I wonder if the lack of website is more of a negative influence than the small shop itself?

We are in a similar boat (or crop field in our case), and the fact that we are so far off the beaten path means almost no one even considers a site visit.

Going one step beyond, you could set up a DBA with a name and website that suits the work you want to pursue, another step for the more stalker-ish purchasing agents to find your location.

 

[Ox]

Doo you want to send a PO to someone that is obviously hiding?
.. and if there's issues ?


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Think Snow Eh!
Ox

 

[john.k]

meantime ,back to the question......a contract is enforcable ,against either party ,and while youd have a battle against a big customer ,I d suspect a customer that was hurt by late or non delivery might enforce his rights against you.