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Tool Presetter results automatic transfer

SmlG54

Aluminum
Joined
Apr 5, 2018
Hello all,
Im looking for a little insight or even some "get reals" on Tool presetter conundrum.


NUTS AND BOLTS:

-We have an "offline" tool presetter. Labels are printed out with tooling information and then the machinist enters that info into control at machine.
-All of the machines are connected to a company network
-I do not know make or model of presetter (:rolleyes5:) Guess question is more conceptual in nature....

QUESTION:
Without purchasing a different tool presetter, is there any possibility of extracting that data and exporting it directly via network to machine. Or using a usb or whatever medium.

I thought about using a macro program or a G10 program to alter tool offset values. I can probably figure out how to write that. HOWEVER, the whole goal is to not have to type the presetter tool information at all. Fat fingers ya know?...

I dont want to overload the post but thats basically brass tax of the situation. Any help or thoughts on subject would be appreciated.

Thanks
SML
 
Possible? Yes. It's done every day.
With your particular presetter? Don't know.

That's not a very good answer, but it would depend on if your presetter can transfer data at all or does it just have a display that you read the numbers off of.
 
In to hear other responses on the subject. I've always wondered this myself.

But it seems to me, somewhere along the line the issue of:
Fat fingers ya know?...
Always comes up in one form or another?


Was playing with the external data stuff on one of my Haas machines a while back. You can write to tool length offsets over RS-232. Seems pretty cool, but surely an easy way to make big mistakes if you don't know what you're doing... or of course, fat-finger something.

Q600 2001 MACRO, 2001, 4.0000 (I think? haven't tried recently, just looking at manual now)
sets tool1(#2001) to length of 4.0000


Perhaps if you can save tool info on your presetter in excel or text file, you could make a excel script import that and send data to your machine.
 
Hello all,
Im looking for a little insight or even some "get reals" on Tool presetter conundrum.


NUTS AND BOLTS:

-We have an "offline" tool presetter. Labels are printed out with tooling information and then the machinist enters that info into control at machine.
-All of the machines are connected to a company network
-I do not know make or model of presetter (:rolleyes5:) Guess question is more conceptual in nature....

QUESTION:
Without purchasing a different tool presetter, is there any possibility of extracting that data and exporting it directly via network to machine. Or using a usb or whatever medium.

I thought about using a macro program or a G10 program to alter tool offset values. I can probably figure out how to write that. HOWEVER, the whole goal is to not have to type the presetter tool information at all. Fat fingers ya know?...

I dont want to overload the post but thats basically brass tax of the situation. Any help or thoughts on subject would be appreciated.

Thanks
SML
.
they sell chip roughly .4" dia and .2" high disc that gets glued in tool holder and chip reader at tool setter can program chip and or program serial number of chip.
.
at cnc many have a chip reader that reads chip. sometimes data from computer network uses chip serial number to read the tool data. type i have seen usually reads needs connection to a computer network
 
Possible? Yes. It's done every day.
With your particular presetter? Don't know.

That's not a very good answer, but it would depend on if your presetter can transfer data at all or does it just have a display that you read the numbers off of.

I really dont know much about the toolsetter. From what I gathered, it only prints out a label.

I understand my question depends on a few factors, but assuming the worst case scenario for this task at hand (just displays numbers on a screen), i was wondering if anyone knew of a way to....i dunno....extract the information from the screen. Oh man, this seems like it is about to get out of hand.....but....

Heres my thoughts:

The information is on a screen. That information is digital data. If there is a label printer, then that means that screen has a port to communicate the information to at least one external device, the printer. I am almost certain there has to be someway to connect to the port where the label printer is and "intercept" the data, write a computer program that converts those "cells of data" (the tool number and offset numbers) into #(system variable) and a macro program that stores the variables accordingly and is then input into the control and then......VOILA. Right?

T'was a shot in the dark and maybe in the dark shall it stay.
 
In to hear other responses on the subject. I've always wondered this myself.

But it seems to me, somewhere along the line the issue of:

Always comes up in one form or another?


Was playing with the external data stuff on one of my Haas machines a while back. You can write to tool length offsets over RS-232. Seems pretty cool, but surely an easy way to make big mistakes if you don't know what you're doing... or of course, fat-finger something.

Q600 2001 MACRO, 2001, 4.0000 (I think? haven't tried recently, just looking at manual now)
sets tool1(#2001) to length of 4.0000


Perhaps if you can save tool info on your presetter in excel or text file, you could make a excel script import that and send data to your machine.

I was thinking something along those lines. I do know that the best way to do it is to just HAVE the machine that produces an NC code for the tool offsets. I can write the generic program (after research that is) but I am trying to figure out a way to get those numbers off the screen of the tool presetter.
 
OK, first, there are toolsetter companies who will sell you toolsetters (for $$$) that are hooked into systems like this.

OR

You could print the label, scan it with a scanner driving an OCR (optical character recognition) software, to produce a blob of text with the label data on it. It's then mere programming (if you are a programmer) to put that text into some database and ship it around the network.

Getting that data into the controller of the machine tool will depend on the particulars of the controller/machine.

You also need some strong way to bind the physical tool holder to the data about the tool in it - DMF_TomB describes one system.

Or, you could dig into how say barcodes or matrix barcodes (think QR code that's a brand for one) Now you print labels with a label maker (think brother or dymo class - I've had decent look with brother labels on tool holders - but I'm not a commercial shop.)

OK, so the holder now has a barcode of some kind, which a barcode reader can read and use to "bring up" the relevent entry in a database.
The toolsetter print out (or read the screen I suppose) is OCR's and attached to that data.
[You MUST keep tidy around the toolsetter, or the wrong label will be used to match data for some other tool - still a fumble finger op.]

Great, so now you have tool setter data matched to tool holder ID data in the computer.

How you get this into your various controllers is up to you. Have A Nice Day with that.
 
I really dont know much about the toolsetter.

This is where you need to start. Dig up all the info you can about the presetter and read it cover to cover. If the label printer is a serial device (RS232 is pretty common for them) then what you want to do is not too tough.

Years ago I did a conversion on an ancient Zoller presetter that just printed out the tool info. It used a serial printer so I just connected it to a PC serial port and captured the data with a DNC program. When all the tools were measured you ended the transfer and saved the file to a work directory. (the following will tell you how long ago this was...) I wrote a little program in QBASIC that parsed out the file and added the associated text (this was for Okuma controls so VTOFH[n]=xx.xxxx where n is the tool number and xx.xxxx is the presetter data) Then the file was saved and downloaded to the machines. The operator would load the tools in the machine, call up the program and press Cycle Start and offsets were loaded.
 
Thanks to all that contributed. It is appreciated.
I think this thread, in a rare way, could be helpful to others as well.

VanCBiker: I agree, I definitely need to know the presetter. Have not had access to it yet. That is first priority.
If it does have RS232, I think the extraction and uploading process will be relatively easy to figure out

Bryan: Im aware of the option to buy a different presetter, that's trails plan B by quite some margin. Thanks for the other options provided.
Both sound doable. Thanks for the insights.

DMF_Tom: Some of the machines are new enough to incorporate chip reading.
I am worried that the permanency of the chip might limit the tool holders applications. Maybe I am thinking about this incorrectly.
As in, if a tool number is associated to a chip but on a different machine that tool holder in the turret is unavailable, and also, if
holding an end mill and the endmill length changes... But I guess that probably seeing a bear behind a bush for no reason. I imagine
those issues can be circumvented.

We can let this thread die if yall want. I do appreciate the thoughts shared but yeah, I need to get to the presetter first eh? Thanks again

SML
 
regarding chip numbers limiting use of a particular tool holder....

people can write software, or contrive systems, that F*** up anything, BUT

if the tags on the toolholders (be they rfid or label or stamped or whatever) have enough bits (digits), and are unique across your environment, then any holder with any tag value should be usable in any machine it fits in.

the headache comes with machines that only store tool data for say 31 tools - such a machine is unlikely to have an rfid reader, and you will need a local pc or the like that maps shop-global rfid values to local T# values. This isn't super hard, but it's another place for mistakes and disorder to arise.
 








 
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