Vactra #2 for spindle lube

[gkemper]

Enco has free shipping on orders over $25 until the end of Jan. Code: FSCJAN

They also have some oils on sale.

 

[knudsen]

Most of the oils are the same or cheaper at Enco, and you can find free shipping and/or 20% off promo codes. I don't have any for this month yet. Usually at least one of the oils is on sale. Whadayano, it's Vactra this month: Enco - Guaranteed Lowest Prices on Machinery, Tools and Shop Supplies

 

[gkemper]

This is what I got from Enco.

505-2002 VELOCITE 10 1 GAL MOBIL SPINDLE OIL $18.54
505-1987 VACTRA #2 1 GAL MOBIL WAY OIL $14.99
Total $33.53 With free shipping.

I use Vactra #2 for everything but the spindle so these 2 are all I need.
It's about a lifetime supply for less than $35.

Remember free shipping code: FSCJAN (good until 1-31-2011)

Considering you can get little 8oz bottles for about $19 with shipping on ebay; spend about $14 extra and get 120oz more of each.
That's 16 times more of each!

 

[knudsen]

Good to have an excess; you won't run out and be tempted to use fish oil or run dry. You can share a cup with a neighbor who just bought a machine or didn't buy enough oil to begin with.

 

[bradjacob]

Came across this from last year, but I am needing to get a full set of lubricants for my SB9A. Any chance of getting in on another round of sharing? Perhaps I can find enough people to share a gallon of Mobil Velocite in my area (Lehigh Valley, Allentown, Bethlehem, Easton, PA).

Count me in! Plus, I live in Easton ;-)

 

[knudsen]

since you guys are going in on an oil order, may I suggest you make it double worth your while and also get the Mobil DTE in iso 32 and 64? Then you have the whole array of recommended fluids, and they are all mobil for compatibility. Many have used the way oil in place of the DTE iso 64 or even used it "everywhere," replacing both iso 32 and 64 with it. But way oil has properties not desirable for bearings, and definitely not for the slapping action of gears. I'm sure someone has run the way oil this way for 20 years and they may or may not have more wear because of it, but if you buy 4 gallons total, DTE iso 32, DTE iso 64, #2 way oil and #10 spindle oil, split it for ways, you 'll be in for $20 and some quart jugs + inter-hobbyist shipping (inter or intra? ). I'm not sold on the idea that what was recommended for a new machine is still the best viscosity on a worn machine, but if you have the iso 32 and 64 on hand, you'll be able to cover it.

If you need oil cans, this one looks bad works good: Enco - Guaranteed Lowest Prices on Machinery, Tools and Shop Supplies

and this one looks good, works bad: Enco - Guaranteed Lowest Prices on Machinery, Tools and Shop Supplies

The first one doesn't look that bad, just the flex hose is Al and looks a little cheap, but it functions well and the nippley tip fits the oil cups.

The second is half the price, looks nice a purdy, and has a chitty pump. c=s. It pumps, but can be hard to get a drop or two out. It's fine for you spindle lube where you are going into an open cup. Should work for the way oil, where you just squirt out a glob, but I haven't tried it.

 

[bradjacob]

...but if you buy 4 gallons total, DTE iso 32, DTE iso 64, #2 way oil and #10 spindle oil, split it for ways, you 'll be in for $20 and some quart jugs...

Knudsen:

So -(minus the Teflon grease for the backgear and oil for the motor)- these are ALL the fluids one needs for a SB lathe?

I know there are scads of info on this, but man... so many opinions, etc...

If this is all we need - then C'mon guys, let's get this going. $20 for all the oils is a great idea.

 

[knudsen]

Yes, that covers your A, B, C, and D oils.

I use spindle oil for the spindle cups, way oil for the ways, and the thinnest DTE that doesn't quickly leak out in all the oilers. A little seepage is good. That means it's getting onto the bearing surface.

I'm undecided on the gears, but I think an open gear grease is best. Messy job to apply by hand, but then you can stop oiling them and leave them greased for a while. Right now I have uber thick/stringy Lucas oil on them. It quieted them way down over the oil that was on them. I over applied, which makes a mess of the cast bell. I was looking at a mobil synthetic grease for open gears, but have yet to order it.

 

[bradjacob]

#2 way oil

Knudsen: Is something like: (ISO 68 Vactra #2) the appropriate way oil?

 

[bradjacob]

Also ----

What are the differences between these three types of oil:

Vactra "Named"
----------------------------------------
ISO 32 Vactra "Light"
ISO 68 Vactra "Heavy Medium"



Vactra "Numbered"
----------------------------------------
ISO 32 Vactra "#1"
ISO 68 Vactra "#2"



"DTE" Series
---------------------------------------
ISO 32 DTE "Light"
ISO 68 DTE "Heavy Medium"

 

[jim rozen]

Mobil One synthetic engine oil is available in those convenient quart
sized bottles, 0W20 wt is a good fit for the total loss SB plain bearing
spindles.

Just food (oil) for thougth.

Of course I cannot guarantee that some damage might occur to the
bearings, as I've only been running that oil for 25 years in my lathe.

 

[knudsen]

Knudsen: Is something like: (ISO 68 Vactra #2) the appropriate way oil?

Yes, you want vactra 2 for the ways, the one on sale: Enco - Guaranteed Lowest Prices on Machinery, Tools and Shop Supplies

Vactra "Named"
----------------------------------------
ISO 32 Vactra "Light"
ISO 68 Vactra "Heavy Medium"



Vactra "Numbered"
----------------------------------------
ISO 32 Vactra "#1"
ISO 68 Vactra "#2"

ISO 32 Vactra "Light" = ISO 32 Vactra "#1"
ISO 68 Vactra "Heavy Medium" = ISO 68 Vactra "#2"

You want #2, ISO 68, Heavy Medium. I think the bottle has all three lables on it

The difference between this and DTE is the additives:

"The Mobil Vactra Oil Numbered Series are premium-quality slideway lubricants"

"The Mobil Vactra Oil Numbered Series is carefully formulated from high-quality base stocks and performance
balanced with an advanced additive system that provides controlled frictional properties, outstanding aqueous
metal working fluid compatibility and corrosion protection of parts and equipment."

"The unique additive package
provides exceptional frictional properties on a wide variety of way materials, including steel on steel and steel
on polymer, reducing stick-slip and chatter. This allows smooth, uniform motion at design travel speeds enhancing
machine productivity and accuracy helping to prolong tool life and enhance surface finish."​

The additives for this are clearly not optimized for bearings.

There is some good bedtime reading on this: http://www.hascooil.com/images/pdfs/Mobil-Aerospace1.pdf

"DTE" Series
---------------------------------------
ISO 32 DTE "Light"
ISO 68 DTE "Heavy Medium"

The additives on the DTE are optimized for bearings and shafts and such:

"This product series is recommended for continous service in the lubrication of plain and rolling bearings and parallel shaft gearing"

"Mobil DTE Oil Named Series lubricants
are formulated from highly refined base stocks and an additive system which provide an extremely high level of chemical and thermal
stability, rapid and complete separation from water and a high resistance to emulsification. They provide excellent protection against
rust and corrosion, including resistance to salt water, and good antiwear properties. They have a high viscosity index which ensures
minimum variation of film thickness with temperature and minimum power loss during the warm up period."​

More quality bedtime reading: http://www.marspetrochem.com/pdf/mobil_dte_named_series.pdf

I agree with Jim, mobil 1 is a very good oil and likely exceeds the needs of all but the spindle application. It is very, very good at protecting against rust on the unpainted surfaces for long periods of time, but requires re-application after handling. I always keep a bottle handy As a way lube on unhard beds, it has a good track record of well over 15 years in the Chinese mini-lathe community. I would have just used it, but the gallons of oils from Enco are less expensive nowadays.

 

[bradjacob]

Thanks Knudsen for all that info.

In a world where eMail can be a bit confusing, this is what I gathered:

- Vactras #2 will be my choice for ways.
- I should get the DTE ISO (32 & 68) for South Bend's type "B" and "C".
- Velocite #10 for the spindle.
- Teflon grease (for back gear and spindle-pulley).

Should this be my shopping list?

And I guess there's no way around having to buy a 5-gallon tub of the DTE light?

 

[jim rozen]

Ah, the spindles on those SB lathes - that's the only place I *do* use the mobil one.

 

[bradjacob]

I use Vactra #2 for everything but the spindle so these 2 are all I need.

Is this the right thing to do?

 

[knudsen]

Is this the right thing to do?

Correct viscosity for many of the oil points, wrong type of oil for bearings and rotating shafts, so I so no, it is wrong, maybe even evil It might work, but DTE is better and made for the task.

 

[knudsen]

Thanks Knudsen for all that info.

In a world where eMail can be a bit confusing, this is what I gathered:

- Vactras #2 will be my choice for ways.
- I should get the DTE ISO (32 & 68) for South Bend's type "B" and "C".
- Velocite #10 for the spindle.
- Teflon grease (for back gear and spindle-pulley).

Should this be my shopping list?

And I guess there's no way around having to buy a 5-gallon tub of the DTE light?

My opinion is oil is better than the teflon grease. It's discussed in the nearby pulley getting warm thread. Oil is against the recommendation of others, so I recommend reading that thread and perhaps doing some web research before deciding Brad's seen the thread, so I'm saying that for the benefit of future readers http://www.practicalmachinist.com/v...arm-when-running-back-gear-any-advice-216503/ ).

You can get the DTE Light in a 1 gal. jug:

DTE Light: Enco - Guaranteed Lowest Prices on Machinery, Tools and Shop Supplies

 

[bradjacob]

You can get the DTE Light in a 1 gal. jug:
DTE Light: Enco - Guaranteed Lowest Prices on Machinery, Tools and Shop Supplies

Hmmm.... The DTE "24" threw me. I was searching for DTE Light (from their drop down list). What's the difference between DTE Light and DTE 24 Light?

By the way Knudsen, THANKS for all this HELPFUL oil info. A good diet (oil) for the machine will ensure it's prolonged health...

Haha... oil/food analogy... Ha...Ha... funny... anyone?

 

[knudsen]

I think they are the same thing.

I use olive oil to lube my taste buds.

 

[rata222]

You can get the DTE Light in a 1 gal. jug:

DTE Light: Enco - Guaranteed Lowest Prices on Machinery, Tools and Shop Supplies

I was researching oil for my 9C and found this not too old thread. Lots of great information.

Knudson.... I have a question on the "B" oil. The link points to hydraulic fluid . Is this best to use or would it be better to use the "DTE SERIES CIRCULATING OIL" that says it is for plain bearings.
Both can be seen on this page.
http://www.use-enco.com/CGI/INPDFF?PMPAGE=936&PMITEM=505-1218

Both are DTE - 32. I will use it mainly for the countershaft. If it will work as well..... I would rather get 1 gal. of the hydraulic fluid than to buy the bearing oil -that only comes in the 5 gal. can.

Thanks.
Jim