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Way WAY OT...time to buy a new car...recommendations?

AFAIK, Mississippi isn't planning to outlaw all gas appliances, or all ICE cars and semis, gas-powered tools, etc. Electricity in Mississippi is $.15 per KWH, not $.50.
Mississippi isn't drowning in billions of debt like California. They don't plan to give illegals a down payment for a house, their firefighters can't retire after 20 years with full 6-figure pay.

We could go on for hours about the dumb shit that California does and plans to do....

California is certainly "leading the way" to an elitist liberal utopia. It's all good until the straw breaks the camel's back....

ToolCat

I mean, I'm not defending either of them... But California has a debt of 21 billion vs a GDP of 3.9 trillion... Mississippi has a debt of 7 billion and a GDP of only 146 million... As a percentage of GDP, California's numbers certainly look better. The no ICE thing is stupid.
 
TeachMe, I just looked up some numbers. It shows 7 billion compared to ~146 billion for Mississippi and 1.6 trillion to 3.9 trillion for Cali.

Hoover Institute says: "California’s state and local government debt is roughly $1.6 trillion, which includes a proper accounting of the state’s unfunded liabilities. To put this in perspective, this works out to about $125,000 of debt per California household and exceeds the annual GDP of all but 13 countries. Newsom Wants to Add $6.4 Billion to California’s $1.6 Trillion Debt with Proposition 1"

I haven't been following along, so my numbers are probably a mile off.
 
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TeachMe, I just looked up some numbers. It shows 7 billion compared to ~146 billion for Mississippi and 1.6 trillion to 3.9 trillion for Cali.

Hover Institute says: "California’s state and local government debt is roughly $1.6 trillion, which includes a proper accounting of the state’s unfunded liabilities. To put this in perspective, this works out to about $125,000 of debt per California household and exceeds the annual GDP of all but 13 countries. Newsom Wants to Add $6.4 Billion to California’s $1.6 Trillion Debt with Proposition 1"

I haven't been following along, so my numbers are probably a mile off.

Yeah, I stupidly used the first number that popped up in a google search for each, because I was in a hurry. Your numbers are likely way more accurate. The 146 million felt stupid as I typed it but I had to walk away so I couldn't search more.
 
Hoover Institute says:

There's the problem .... that was the guy who fed the Depression, his grasp of numbers was less than stellar.

I'm not going to defend the idjuts in sacratomato, they have the brains of a flea and couldn't budget a hot dog stand, but these numbers are imaginary in the other direction. Just a couple years ago California had budget surpluses. Gov Moonbeam was hell on wheels about a reserve fund, which is why a bunch of programs now are not in the toilet, seven fat years seven lean years and all that. Newslime will probably piss it away and never replenish but anyhow, you don't go from money in the bank to 125,000/person in debt back to money in the bank that easy. Those numbers are just right-wing propaganda.
 
AFAIK, Mississippi isn't planning to outlaw all gas appliances, or all ICE cars and semis, gas-powered tools, etc. Electricity in Mississippi is $.15 per KWH, not $.50.
Mississippi isn't drowning in billions of debt like California. They don't plan to give illegals a down payment for a house, their firefighters can't retire after 20 years with full 6-figure pay.

We could go on for hours about the dumb shit that California does and plans to do....

California is certainly "leading the way" to an elitist liberal utopia. It's all good until the straw breaks the camel's back....

ToolCat
So that fact that red states have lead the way in murder rate for, oh, what 20 years is nothing, but taking away your gas stove* is the end of the world.

get real
*[lets be accurate, limiting the installations of gas appliances in new buildings]
 
I just looked at AJ Madison, a major online retailer of appliances. They have over 500 gas stoves listed. They wiil ship to your door. Not extinct quite yet. I live in the country, so I can hook anything I want up to my propane tank, and you could in cali too. Besides, as a great man once said, “ In the long run, we will all be dead. “ think I will make me some eggs on the gas cooktop I ordered mail order, and installed myself, like the old self reliant leftist hippie I am…
 
*[lets be accurate, limiting the installations of gas appliances in new buildings]
No, they've made it illegal to replace worn out or burned out old gas appliances as well. And illegal to sell them. And mail order places won't ship to california, there's already a lot of products like that. Yes, you'll be able to jump in the pickemup and drive to a nearby or faraway state, buy one and drag it home, I guess. Maybe.

The interesting part of this equation is older houses often have low-amperage service entrances. So your gas stove goes out, you now need another 100 amps for a new electric oven/range combo, or water heater, but your service is too small. But you can't just uppy the service like that, you have to bring the entire house up to current standards to do that. Bye-bye $40,000 or so.

What a fiasco.

but while I'm here, gustibus ... kinda rainy again today,

IMG_7370.jpg

so I didn't capture any ruling communist party horrific china pollution, thought maybe we could hop to another one of the misdeeds of the authoritarian dictatorship ?

A short time ago standard posted this (if the link is bad it's post #109)


for your convenience I'll quote part of it here

"Delivery of the Badger Hollow and Paris solar panels was halted in late 2022 by U.S. Customs and Border Protection as it investigated whether polysilicone used the Chinese manufacturer, LONGi, to make the panels was produced by forced labor.Jan 4, 2024"

and gosh, unfortunately my memory still works, I used to do work for Prison Industry Authority, the forced labor operation in california ... a quick bit of looking led me to wikipedia, which you are welcome to dispute, but, well ...


let me just quote a short section again for your convenience

"Most prisoners in the U.S. are required to work and all state prison systems and the federal system have some form of penal labor. Although inmates are paid for their labor in most states, they usually receive less than $1 per hour. As of 2017, Arkansas, Georgia, and Texas did not pay inmates for any work whether inside the prison (such as custodial work and food services) or in state-owned businesses. Additionally, Alabama, Florida, Mississippi, Oklahoma, and South Carolina allowed unpaid labor for at least some jobs. Prison workers in the US are generally exempt from workers' rights and occupational safety protections, including when seriously injured or killed".

Could I ask you to comment on this ? If you could supplement the words holier-than-thou hypocrites, propaganda-spewing shitheads, sanctimonious two-faced slandering scumbuckets, mendacious double-dealing imposters, posturing pretentious fraudsters, and the like, that'd be great, I'm running out of adjectives to describe the neocon assholes driving this bus ....
 
No, they've made it illegal to replace worn out or burned out old gas appliances as well. And illegal to sell them. And mail order places won't ship to california, there's already a lot of products like that. Yes, you'll be able to jump in the pickemup and drive to a nearby or faraway state, buy one and drag it home, I guess. Maybe.
um, no.
There are no laws in effect right now that do most of that.
A few building departments are not allowing gas lines in new construction,
You can buy a new gas appliance pretty much anywhere in cali. The Lowes store on Pico in LA offers over 600 choices, although, most likely, only 20 or 30 are in stock.
The big national retailers will ship whatever you want, wherever you want, except Alaska and Hawaii, because, money.

Berkeley lost in court in march, trying to ban gas appliances.

The sky is falling, sure. But it wont hit anytime soon, and in the interim anyone can stock up on gas appliances.

And what kind of a real machinist would buy a house with a 100 amp service? I bought my place cause there was 3 phase on the pole. Us liberals believe in being prepared and I have 400 amps of 3 phase, you try to pry that out of my cold dead hands. I got litte sympathy for whining obedient sububanites anyway. America is full of cheap abandoned factories and you can have TEN gas stoves in a row in Beaver Pa or Detroit or Gary Indiana. Whole mill towns for sale in the woolen belt in the southeast for less tha a 3 bedroom rambler in the antelope valley. As old Ronnie Reagan said, vote with your feet. Except, he didnt, and most wimpy cali maga heads wont either, because cali is the 4 th biggest economy in the world and you get paid more there.
 
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The big national retailers will ship whatever you want, wherever you want, except Alaska and Hawaii, because, money.
I'll let people in california deal with the rest because they are dealing with this right now and know more than me. But the above statement is wrong, as anyone who lives in California will tell you. There's all sorts of products that "big retailers" will not ship to California, money or no money. Lots.
 
"No, they've made it illegal to replace worn out or burned out old gas appliances as well. And illegal to sell them. And mail order places won't ship to california, there's already a lot of products like that. Yes, you'll be able to jump in the pickemup and drive to a nearby or faraway state, buy one and drag it home, I guess. Maybe."

Hey life's tough all over. Women from red states have to jump in the pickmeup and drive to a faraway state just to get reproductive healthcare.
 
I'll let people in california deal with the rest because they are dealing with this right now and know more than me. But the above statement is wrong, as anyone who lives in California will tell you. There's all sorts of products that "big retailers" will not ship to California, money or no money. Lots.
I am referring to appliances. You are obviously referring to things like toxic chemicals. different area of the paranoia node of the brain. The current conversation refers to gas appliances. If you wanta talk toulene and acetone, I am sure there is another thread dedicated to that.
 
I am referring to appliances. You are obviously referring to things like toxic chemicals.
It could be live frogs (which are under attack at the moment) ... it doesn't matter. If it's illegal to have them in california, retailers will not ship whatever the product in question is to california.

If/when they make gas appliances illegal, then retailers will not ship them. That's already been demonstrated.
 
It could be live frogs (which are under attack at the moment) ... it doesn't matter. If it's illegal to have them in california, retailers will not ship whatever the product in question is to california.

If/when they make gas appliances illegal, then retailers will not ship them. That's already been demonstrated.
if and when. thats what I said, too.
which means, not now.
and no law is currently on the books with a date.


I lived in Southern California for over ten years, and even then, people were bitching and moaning about the Air Management District- and, yet, somehow, auto body shops still painted cars, parts washers still existed, industry still made literally billions of dollars of stuff.
Industry adapts, and figures out alternative methods, and, usually, pays less in insurance claims and workers injuries.
Individuals, who maybe buy a quart of paint thinner every two years, go nuts about their lost freedom.

The fact remains- you CAN buy a gas stove at any home depot in California, right now. You can buy ten if you want.
 
Gas stoves came out only after electric stoves were being sold. The first home gas service was in Bakersfield California for stoves and water heaters. AFAIK Bakersfield still has the lowest gasoline prices in the state since they have wells and at least one refinery in town.
Bill D
 
I'm not going to defend the idjuts in sacratomato, they have the brains of a flea and couldn't budget a hot dog stand, but these numbers are imaginary in the other direction. Just a couple years ago California had budget surpluses. Gov Moonbeam was hell on wheels about a reserve fund, which is why a bunch of programs now are not in the toilet, seven fat years seven lean years and all that. Newslime will probably piss it away and never replenish but anyhow, you don't go from money in the bank to 125,000/person in debt back to money in the bank that easy. Those numbers are just right-wing propaganda.
You'll feel this one. Maybe @eaglemike too. Probably a bunch of guys not in this thread.

 
AQI for Gary IN = 41, East Chicago IN = 47, Whiting IN = 28. That's two cities stuffed with steel mills and related industry and one with a BP oil refinery.
 
AQI for Gary IN = 41, East Chicago IN = 47, Whiting IN = 28. That's two cities stuffed with steel mills and related industry and one with a BP oil refinery.
That is a really good thing. Any time anywhere on the world cleans up any kind of emissions, it's a good thing for all of us.

But it wasn't the point.

The point was and is, for about the past ten years there has been a concerted effort to portray china in the worst possible light. In fact the state department set up a 1.5 billion dollar program to teach the press how to lie about china. Yes I better go find the item in the budget but no I am not making this up. Fuck obama and his "pivot to the pacific" this ain't 1952 no more, assbreath.

These people are liars. Proven liars. They lied about korea, they lied through their teeth about vietnam, they lied about iran, they lied about every country in south america that they hadn't destroyed yet, they lied about iraq they lied about afghanistan, they lied about kosovo they lied about syria they do nothing but lie lie lie lie lie and every one of their fucking worthless stupid lies ("aluminum tubes ! they're making nukes !") has fucked up the US worse and worse and worse. The problems the US has are problems the US made all for its self all by itself.

WHY do you people just keep following along like a huge herd of sheep, time after time after time after time ?

sheeple.jpg

Anyway, the point was gus'es US propaganda about the horrific Chinese air pollution. That hasn't been true for ten years now. This particular propaganda is quite easy to discredit, for people with two eyes and a functioning brain.

It's certainly not upstate Washington and never will be (the air circulates in a giant clockwise swirl over the pacific. US air is cold and dry coming from the north, China air is hot and wet coming from the south. Hot and wet is always going to be messier than cold and dry ... anyway) but it's not 2005 anymore, either.

Point is this lying dishonest shit from the establishment should be pounded back up their ass with a giant wooden mallet till it pops out the front and dings the bell. They are the scum of the universe and should be recognized as such.

Unfortunately, while I was busy memorizing the communist party line, I accidentally clicked on the wrong links and came across a couple videos dramatically showing both the horrific pollution endemic to the country and the miserable lives of its poor downtrodden citizens. Guess I'm going to have to rethink my position :(


 
It really isn't all that telling to look at the instantaneous AQI on any given day. It's more accurate to look at averages across the year. That tells it like it is, IMO.


 








 
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