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Why should an employee have confidence in your business?

William Payne

Hot Rolled
Joined
May 29, 2016
Location
Wanganui, New Zealand
Right now on this forum there is a thread where a gentlemen is asking how to justify to his employers the need for automatic door openers for garage doors in their building.

Many many threads where employers talk about the struggles of finding work, the struggles of paying employees a good wage, the struggles of earning a profit just enough to get through the next month.

Yet employees are told that if they don’t like it they should go start their own business and see how hard it is for themselves.

Well when an employee is trying to give himself a better life, put a roof over his head, clothes on his back, and food on his table, and maybe provide for a wife and children and provide a good better life for them.

Why should that employee have any confidence in any employer if things are that bad? If things are truly that difficult and that financially oppressive why should an employee of any kind see it as a good career move?

I have never owned a business. I am asking from the eyes of someone who has been an employee in a company that had a forklift with a check engine light on for over 2 years.
 
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Excellent point.
Here's my view -
When an employee takes a job, it is the beginning of a relationship, and like all relationships, there's a familiarization period, a "honeymoon" and then the relationship itself.
Many times one side of the relationship will make a suggestion, that may or may not, be well received by the other side.

As a shop owner, and one who was on your side of the equation for many years, I can appreciate your suggestion and the spirit with which you offer it.

When I worked for dad, I plead for a replacement for the Victor CNC lathe that was giving me fits, and for an additional CNC mill to handle the bottleneck that was occurring that the one that we had. Those pleas fell on deaf ears. However, I did my part by making sure that the one VMC we did have was always ready to go for the next job, and, when I started my own shop, I made sure not to make the same errors.

The auto door suggestion is a good one. However, you're looking at a $10k US (or more) upgrade and the machine down for at least a few days, not to mention the modifications needed if there are no spare M codes or open relays on the control itself.

However... when the time comes for a new VMC - and if you're still there, you're now in a great spot to put in a request for that option as a factory install which may not be as expensive or time consuming.
 
Excellent point.
Here's my view -
When an employee takes a job, it is the beginning of a relationship, and like all relationships, there's a familiarization period, a "honeymoon" and then the relationship itself.
Many times one side of the relationship will make a suggestion, that may or may not, be well received by the other side.

As a shop owner, and one who was on your side of the equation for many years, I can appreciate your suggestion and the spirit with which you offer it.

When I worked for dad, I plead for a replacement for the Victor CNC lathe that was giving me fits, and for an additional CNC mill to handle the bottleneck that was occurring that the one that we had. Those pleas fell on deaf ears. However, I did my part by making sure that the one VMC we did have was always ready to go for the next job, and, when I started my own shop, I made sure not to make the same errors.

The auto door suggestion is a good one. However, you're looking at a $10k US (or more) upgrade and the machine down for at least a few days, not to mention the modifications needed if there are no spare M codes or open relays on the control itself.

However... when the time comes for a new VMC - and if you're still there, you're now in a great spot to put in a request for that option as a factory install which may not be as expensive or time consuming.

Thank you kindly for your reply. Your logic regarding automatic doors on a machine are sound. But the gentleman in question was referring to garage doors in a building.

I should have been more clear. I will edit for better clarity.
 
Well when an employee is trying to give himself a better life, put a roof over his head, clothes on his back, and food on his table, and maybe provide for a wife and children and provide a good better life for them.
Employers are trying to do the same.

Why should that employee have any confidence in any employer if things are that bad? If things are truly that difficult and that financially oppressive why should an employee of any kind see it as a good career move?
I think that is where honesty on the owners part comes into play. If I was working for an owner and business was getting slow and he lied to me about it and played it off. I'm gone. BUT. If he looked me right in the eye and said "Rich business is down a bit, but I think it will pick up by years end and we can look at making some improvements in the shop" or something to that affect , I can respect that. How you treat employees has a lot with how they treat you. Now I am just a manager, but I try to always be as open and honest with my employees as I can. Thats just me though. I am sure others have a different point of view.
 
Employers are trying to do the same.


I think that is where honesty on the owners part comes into play. If I was working for an owner and business was getting slow and he lied to me about it and played it off. I'm gone. BUT. If he looked me right in the eye and said "Rich business is down a bit, but I think it will pick up by years end and we can look at making some improvements in the shop" or something to that affect , I can respect that. How you treat employees has a lot with how they treat you. Now I am just a manager, but I try to always be as open and honest with my employees as I can. Thats just me though. I am sure others have a different point of view.

I agree with you regarding your comments about how to communicate the situation.
 
Some good thots. It's been interesting how a person's perspective changes. I started out as employee in small shop (new mfg), and rolled my eyes at some of the stuff the boss did. Of course I thot I was worth more than he thot I was especially once I started computing what I was earning for him. I was on the point of burn out. Then he asked if i would manage the shop while he was gone for 3 years of mission work. I loved it, but also began to see some reason behind some of his actions. When he came back I relocated. In 2017 the opportunity arose to buy a business doing much the same type of products in a different region. Now I am feeling the weight of actually being the guy who has to write the checks, fix the mistakes, make the sales, find the employees, (not having much luck with that)
That being said would I be a good boss? Too soon to tell..... judging by the most enjoyable years I'd do better managing production for someone else......
 
For sure.....the business is struggling ,bad management decisions at every turn.....and both partners wives driving new $200,000 cars ...........and I might add,both partners on third wives .........my own business partner in the 70s and 80s was a complete idiot with women ...again third wife ,and cheating............IMHO ,sane people do not go into business ,from what Ive seen.
 
For sure.....the business is struggling ,bad management decisions at every turn.....and both partners wives driving new $200,000 cars ...........and I might add,both partners on third wives .........my own business partner in the 70s and 80s was a complete idiot with women ...again third wife ,and cheating............IMHO ,sane people do not go into business ,from what Ive seen.

I have met more owners chasing a lifestyle than I have owners wanting to build a great business.
 
I will give you a tid bit that actually applies to any employee on here.
Or small shop owners who have never read a business book to save their lives.

I am older and have been an employee for all but the last 5 years.
But prior to that I was mentored by a 35 year business owner with a large business.
And in that time I read a few books and watch a few videos on business related subjects.

it changed how I did/do business, but also changed me as how I thought and operated within a business as an employee.

this actually rocketed up my experience and pay, and my positive attitude as an employee.

I better knew the circumstances of what they needed, wanted, and how I fit, it was much better.
being like a business owner who didn't own a business yet, but still was working as an employee.

I would recommend every employee actually learn business to be a better employee for everyone, themselves mostly,
but also so you can run your own business if you ever feel you want to, and be better informed as to if you do want to,
its not cut out for everyone, even some here only own a job.

hope this helps :cheers:
 
Its all about the attitude, some think like bosses and other's think like worker's.

 
Shop owners can only do what they can do.

If his machines and skills can only produce $25 an hour then he can't have shop air conditioning and pay 50 bucks per hour.
That is one thing wrong with out-reach thinking. People only view form their vantage point based in their imagination and science.
like "Let them eat cake", when they can’t afford to make bread.

Somebody who only wants a bowl of rice and a blanket for vesting a few hours of work doesn't need $50k a year ($25 x 2000 hours year)

Some California surfers have a wonderful life begging 50 bucks a day, go figure.
Thinking that everybody needs everything is wrong thinking
 
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Shop owners can only do what they can do.
If his machines and skills can only produce $25 and hour then he can't have air conditioning and pay 50 bucks per hour.
That is one thing wrong with out reach thinking..people only view form their vantage point.
like "Let them eat cake", when they cant afford to make bread.

It’s a tough one. I know local to me when a petrol station pays $30 an hour to man the counter why earn $25 as a machinist?

I really don’t know what the answer is.
 
It’s a tough one. I know local to me when a petrol station pays $30 an hour to man the counter why earn $25 as a machinist?

I really don’t know what the answer is.
Actually just to this phrase the answer is simple math,
it shows that if a person can get paid more money to do an easier unskilled job,
but a harder skilled job elsewhere pays less money.
That the business in question is actually a failed business that the employees are keeping alive for the owners benefit.
The math kinda is what it is.
It just shows that there are machine shops that either should be shut down, or reduced back to one man shows.

But also your going to see the petrol job @$30 going away currently(pay cuts) and more so soon, it was a hiccup due to an event , the exception for a period, not the rule.
Do some research it has already started.

Young generations with the education of the internet have started to revamp the entire system though, do some research on that also, times are a changn.
 
Actually just to this phrase the answer is simple math,
it shows that if a person can get paid more money to do an easier unskilled job,
but a harder skilled job elsewhere pays less money.
That the business in question is actually a failed business that the employees are keeping alive for the owners benefit.
The math kinda is what it is.
It just shows that there are machine shops that either should be shut down, or reduced back to one man shows.

But also your going to see the petrol job @$30 going away currently(pay cuts) and more so soon, it was a hiccup due to an event , the exception for a period, not the rule.
Do some research it has already started.

Young generations with the education of the internet have started to revamp the entire system though, do some research on that also, times are a changn.

The gas station job was only listed last week.

I completely agree with what you say. I fully believe that there are many businesses that really have no fundamental viability and if the staff walked out would be gone.

In some ways getting fired due to injury was a benefit. It got me out of there. All the people I worked with knew the problems and everyone agreed on them being problems but nobody was ever willing to stand up and demand change.

I did. But I don’t work there any more.
 
If his machines/tools and skills can only produce $25 and hour then he can't have air conditioning and pay 50 bucks per hour.
So, with demanding that guy pay $30 per, both he and his worker are out of business and a job.
A government regulated economy works with communism and the like, but most often worker class people are just scraping by.
QT: (to stand up and demand change.) or learn better skills, or apply at the better paying shop, move out of the mountains and go to where the jobs are.
Dont fource the guy who only has shovels for tools to pay the same as the guy with bulldozzers.
 
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If his machines/tools and skills can only produce $25 and hour then he can't have air conditioning and pay 50 bucks per hour.

So with demanding that guy pay $30 per, both he and his worker are out of bussiness and a job.
Correct, but the same will happen when the workers go elsewhere for better pay.

There really isn’t an easy solution to that.
 
QT: (Correct, but the same will happen when the workers go elsewhere for better pay.)
The low payer wil continue to train new people who need a job to get started..and perhaps go to the better place, if having that effort. ..like what we used to call a student job or a starting job.
Agree there is no stock answer except regulating by the government, I think that way is the poor way.
 
QT: (Correct, but the same will happen when the workers go elsewhere for better pay.)
The low payer wil continue to train new people who need a job to get started..and perhaps go to the better place, if having that effort. ..like what we used to call a student job or a starting job.
Agree there is no stock answer except regulating by the government, I think that way is the poor way.

In my case the lower payer was 100% reliant on getting trained people from elsewhere and refused to submit any time for training. Which is going to destroy them anyway because where I am from everyone stopped training years ago.
 
I really don’t know what the answer is.
Leadership, instead of the fucked-up "free market" dog eat dog system the US currently loves, where everyone is screaming at each other over stupid shit that doesn't matter, while the house burns down.

So take the dog for a walk instead and don't worry about it, cuz there's nothing you can do. We are surrounded by imbeciles. Outnumbered to the nth.
 
Dont fource the guy who only has shovels for tools to pay the same as the guy with bulldozzers.
I like it:D

But you gotta wonder, maybe the guy with the shovels is just bullshitting himself, in a market that requires bulldozers.

If I started an in ground pool business trying to compete against installers with tractors, but I had a truck full of shovels willing to pay pennies to guys with shovels
to do the same job but take far longer to do it, I may be bullshitting myself as to the viability of the business and the value it offers.
 








 
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