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Mill suggestions with a very long X travel AND can nod the head

Dope

Cast Iron
Joined
Jan 16, 2016
I'm posting here in Heavy Iron as that's all I own, machines from the 30s to the 60s. I'm looking for another similar vintage machine (since that's all I can afford). I am the maker of the world's heaviest swords and I have been machining the blades for a while, however it takes forever as I have to do multiple setups per blade edge/bevel. Sometimes up to 3 per bevel as my machines mostly have 28-32" X travels on them. With most swords having 8 bevels you can get the idea of how long all the setups take (weeks, sometimes).

Furthermore, with peeling 100-200lb+ off of each 500lb+ blade blank, I need a stout machine with a 50 taper spindle and 5HP+. I mention this because I understand that many knee mills can nod their heads but most knee mills are R8, maybe a 40 taper at best. The mill MUST be able to nod the head in order to do the angled bevels. I am currently using a 24x48" sine table to do these bevels but it is incredibly cumbersome, especially since I'm using it on a horizontal (Cincinnati #2 dial-type). I have to raise the table with a gantry crane, etc.. Looking to eliminate all that pain and annoyance.

Finally, if at all possible, I'm looking for all of this in as reasonably small/light a package as possible. I don't need some 50HP monster, 5-15HP is more than enough. Something that isn't insanely heavy would be nice too, as I don't want to risk my shop floor with a 20,000lb mill (nevermind the expense and hassle of moving something like that). You get the idea.

Cliff's notes: looking for dream mill suggestions. 60"+ of X-travel, table capacity 600lb+, able to nod the head (NOT tilt side to side, I mean in and out) and keep it reasonably sized and priced (like $10k not $100k).

I've been keeping an eye out for months and months but have not found what I'm looking for. I watch CL, FB, ebay, and every auction within a dozen hour's drive. It seems like Huron or Huron-style mills are probably the closest to what I need, their 2-part segmented vertical heads seem like they should be able to nod (if I'm visualizing it correctly). However, I've never seen one in person and can't find any that within a few hundred miles (and even then, they're smaller mills). Even the most basic leads might be able to help me with ideas. I even considered a planer or adapting a planer with a milling head but that feels like 10x the work.
 
60+ inches is going to have to be a bed mill. I don't think I've ever seen a bed mill with a nodding head. But you are into serious machine weight here. Probably 15K+, certainly 10K +. If you can find something with suitable travel you may have to adapt a vertical head that will nod.

Seems to me like you should be looking at a #4 Nazel.
 
60+ inches is going to have to be a bed mill. I don't think I've ever seen a bed mill with a nodding head. But you are into serious machine weight here. Probably 15K+, certainly 10K +. If you can find something with suitable travel you may have to adapt a vertical head that will nod.

Seems to me like you should be looking at a #4 Nazel.
Yes, I should have mentioned that, I assumed it would end up being a bed mill.

Nazel #4 looks to be a power hammer and not a mill? Wait, nevermind, obviously a joke...
 
You might get a long travel mill and a tool cutter grinder to make your own angle nose cutters.

You could make a convex 20" radius on a cutter and so mill a hollow edge for the straight portion of the blade

 
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I’d seriously consider building specific fixtures for these. Plasma cut plates, 2-3 wedges at whatever angle, stitch weld it together. Make fixtures for whatever your common angles are.

Then you can use a heavy NMTB 50 taper mill and not worry about the nod. I know you’re saying you’re using a heavy sine plate now, but fixtures as described would be a bit lighter and more rigid.
 
Yes, I should have mentioned that, I assumed it would end up being a bed mill.

Nazel #4 looks to be a power hammer and not a mill? Wait, nevermind, obviously a joke...
No joke. Iron and steel tools were forged long before they were machined. A little experience and you wouldn't need to mill off and throw away 200# of chips.
 
You might get a long travel mill and a tool cutter grinder to make your own angle nose cutters.

You could make a convex 20" radius on a cutter and so mill a hollow edge for the straight portion of the blade

That would probably be a pretty good idea if I wasn't roughing 100lb++ of HRC 52 steel from each blank. I'm mostly using inserted facemills and I go through a lot of inserts (about 90 minutes of cutting per edge). If I want a hollow grind I can just tip the facemill in a little bit.
 
I’d seriously consider building specific fixtures for these. Plasma cut plates, 2-3 wedges at whatever angle, stitch weld it together. Make fixtures for whatever your common angles are.

Then you can use a heavy NMTB 50 taper mill and not worry about the nod. I know you’re saying you’re using a heavy sine plate now, but fixtures as described would be a bit lighter and more rigid.

Yes, that's a good idea and one I've considered. The problem is, all of my work is one-off so there are no common angles. I've never made the same sword twice (yet).
 
No joke. Iron and steel tools were forged long before they were machined. A little experience and you wouldn't need to mill off and throw away 200# of chips.
So you're saying that I should just hold onto this 500lb blank with my hands and work it in the power hammer? Or am i missing part of the equation?
 
Butler Elgamill.
Oooooo now we're talking. Looks right up my alley. Unfortunately, a quick google reveals zero for sale in the states. Well, there might be one in IL with no information so I emailed them...
 
Look for an old planer with a 40-taper milling head like a Bridgeport Series II adapted to it. Then you nod becomes a sideways tilt crossways to the table.
Yes, as mentioned I have indeed considered this option. Have just never found one. Figured I'd adapt one myself but a good planer seems to cost a fortune and/or be insanely rare. A lot of them need tons of work. After about two years of trying to locate one, I've more or less given up. Figure I might as well just get a bed mill and have it be a bit more versatile than an adapted planer.
 
So you're saying that I should just hold onto this 500lb blank with my hands and work it in the power hammer? Or am i missing part of the equation?
Maybe with a jib crane, along with your hands. Big hammers need some sort of crane to support the work they are capable of. Forging would cut down both machining time and waste significantly.

As far as a planer goes, unless I'm missing something about your requirements I don't see why it needs to have a milling head adapted. Cutting bevels is a perfect job for a standard planer, and generally machines of the size you'd need go for scrap money.
 
You need to spend some 'tube time looking at forging videos. Men have been forging very heavy iron since well before the advent of electricity. A spring suspended chain fall to take the weight and a long handle on the other end for maneuverability. I don't know your cross section, but it seems like 50# of hammer per inch of cross section was about right.
 
I do not know why shapers and planers are not hip with the blade crowd.

Flexdrill is a long x travel bed mill. Can easily handle the weight you are talking about. Not cat50.
 
That's actually kind of a cottage industry here in the countryside - take old bearings and beat them into plate, then make hand-forged cleavers out of them.
Have you seen the cleavers made from artillery rounds fired onto one of the Straits island's. What's that saying "ploughshares from guns"

 








 
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