Very OT--home windows.

[fmari --MariTool-]

Ok guys forgive me for the very off topic post. The casement windows for my house are over 16 years old. The wood frame and all hardware are in great shape. But some windows are fogging in between the glass. What should I do? Replace the whole window and frame or just replace the glass that is fogged. If I planed on living here for a long time I would just put in new windows but I plan on moving in maybe 3-5 years.

 

[Sander]

New windows can be a selling point. I'd upgrade. Not only will you save on heating/cooling but they'll be more secure as well as better looking.

 

[AndyF]

I'd take a look at replacement sash rather than replacing the whole window. It's a much quicker/cleaner install and if the jambs are in good shape will be a good way to go.

 

[Frederick Harvie]

When you say between the glass I presume these are sealed thermopane units. If they are in fact termopane units I would check with the manufacturer . Many windows that I have seen have a advertized warrenty on the seal longer then the current age of you windows.

 

[fmari --MariTool-]

I checked already, out of warranty. Yes they are thermopane.

 

[metlmunchr]

My brother-in-law has been in the glass contracting business for about 20 years. He says its not a matter of "if" thermopane glass will fail, but rather "when". Various warranty lengths are available from the same manufacturer, for the same product. Simply a matter of how much warranty you want to buy.

You can buy replacement insulated glass units from multiple sources. Most any large glass distributor has the ability to make them, and some independent glass shops also have the required equipment. Any of these will be far cheaper than buying them as replacement parts from the window manufacturer.

The installation is going to depend on the original construction of the window. In a lot of instances the frame is assembled around the glass unit and glued up with the glass captured in a groove in the frame members. On these you typically have to cut away the wood on one side with a router, replace the glass unit, and then replace the wood that's been cut away with an applied wood stop. In most instances, disassembly of the frame at the corners isn't possible by any means that would leave you with recoverable parts.

 

[fmari --MariTool-]

Has anyone had the same problem as me? Please chime in.

 

[SteveF]

I had the identical problem. Called "Glass Doctor" - Motto - "We fix your panes". Get it!?????

Came out, measured panes that needed replacement, came out a week later, removed stripping on outside and took panes out of sash, put new panes in sash and resealed. About $500 for 4 windows. Price varies quite a bit with window size.

Steve.

 

[Cheenist]

I have a whole room full of Anderson casements. They were installed in 1986 and several are starting to fog. It looks like I just un-bolt the casement and replace it...window and frame.
Carl

 

[Frederick Harvie]

I had a similar problem but diffrent in that my window had a crack in it from an impact. I called Kohler who made the windows originaly and the looked up the size of the sealed pane from the original order and a week or so later sent out a crew to install it. I expected a bill as it was no fault of the manufacturer but never received one. The instalation was done by removing some trim molding holding the glss in . The window fram itself did not have to be removed. I would think that most brands would be made for easy glass replacement because windows do get broken on ocassion.

 

[Brian@VersaMil]

Windows fogging up is common. Count your lucky stars your wood isn't rotten. The house I'm in has all Pella windows, most dating from 1939. Wood in them is in great shape. A Pella window installed in 1999 ROTTED OUT in less than four years! It's on the south side of my house where we get driving rain and lots of wind. I just bought a new Pella window to replace their rotten one, and although it's their top of the line CLAD window, triple paned, and theoretically guaranteed from rotting out- it's a poorly made window, made out of finger jointed pine. Although the outside is clad, wind can drive the rain right into the middle of the frame, where it's plain unpainted non- rot resisting pine. The seals on the casement windows don't even keep the rain out on a brand new window.

As an advanced woodworker, machinist, I can tell a piece of junk, from the real deal. Wish I had thoroughly inspected their windows before I popped for over two grand for a new one. I'll NEVER buy another Pella window. So if you're thinking of replacing the entire window, think twice before buying Pella casement windows. I have an inexpensive vinyl window in my woodshop, and frankly I think it will outlast any wood window made. Although its seal on the glass could fail too.

 

[j king]

I installed Anderson Windows and I cant speak highly enough for the way they take care of any problems.I had a casement go bad.Phoned them.Had a new one in less than a week.Nobody came and looked or no questions as to am I sure it was bad.I had a frenchwood sliding patio door have the outer skin start to peel.Not a problem.They apologize and get it sent out.Also had the wife decorate the slider at Xmas and the kids slide it open and waded up the decorations into the middle seal.It tore.I called them to order a new one and they said"We will send you one at no charge." Cant beat them.Also the first winter the screws sweat and the heads rusted.I called to complain and they apologized and sent a bag full.Will buy them again and they will be around in the future.

 

[superalloy]

Brian, Pella used to make a very good product - as you know from your pre-war Deluxe Casements - recently their quality has slipped significantly. My brother put new Pellas in his house, built about 8 years ago. He has had problems with his as well - similar to what you describe. I think it is a design defect with the way the cladding is sealed to the wood. The older ones don't seem to have this problem. Don't know about their most recent products, but I understand there have been some re-designs. They also need to be installed properly. They've used FJ white pine for years and years. That by itself shouldn't be a problem.

My dad was a Pella distributor for years, and another one of my brothers currently is one. Things have changed a lot in Pella company over the years. The Kuiper family is pretty much out of the picture now, and the company's now run by MBA hotshots.

You should contact the distributor and get a replacement for your defective unit.

P.S. you don't need triple pane in Oregon...

 

[Paula]

Responding to the original post... I've had the same problem with my Certainteed vinyl frame windows (installed circa 1993). Last summer I had (4) fogged units replaced by a local dealer. The guy came to the house, removed the affected sash units (about 10 minutes), replaced the sealed glass units, and reinstalled them about 5 days later. These were approx. 24" square. Total mat'l and labor was $231.00

Paula

 

[Brian@VersaMil]

Super alloy- I did contact my distributor and talked to them several times. They sent their installers out to look at the old rotten window and did nothing. I have the paper work stating the wood has a five year warranty. They claim, whatever super sealant they spray on the pine, makes it not rot. My all wood window which I caulked yearly, rotted between the sill plate and the bottoms of the windows. The hardware for the casement was screwed into totally punky wood.
Between the casements and the fixed window, it also rotted. There was NO caulking in these areas, which allowed water in. These are joints put together at the distributor, not out in the field. Their theory is if it was caulked, the water getting in couldn't escape. OKAy makes sense, but then the water that does get in, can sit and rot out the wood.

The last house I had, I built myself and it had all Pella windows and doors. I never had any problem with them, although I bought them in 1989. That house though had a two foot overhang, which really protects the windows and siding. The house I'm in now has NO overhang at all, and the south windows really get the full brunt of wind and rain.

The problem with Pella clad or solid wood windows is the design. Despite their advertising claims to the contrary, these windows are destined to fail, if exposed to any amount of wind driven rain. Even the FIXED window has a 3/8 inch gap around the perimeter, with a seal, that allows water into the interior of the frame. The only thing keeping rain and wind from entering the house is a small seal on the interior of the window. This seal has the ability to compress about 1/8 of an inch. In the corners this seal isn't even carefully mitered. Any flaws in the seal, or if the window isn't PERFECTLY plumb, or if the wall has a slight bow, it does not allow the window to seal. Stupid. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see what a poor design they have. As a company they should take care of someone who has spent around forty thousand dollars with them. I bought the triple pane window simply because I figured I'd get the most efficient window they have. Too bad, the mechanical portion of the window makes the glass portion a waste. I get air and water coming in the corners of the swing out casements of my new window. They're coming next week to replace the seals.

 

[SteveF]

I can tell you from hanging out on the Fine Homebuilding forums - NONE of those folks have anything good to say about Pella windows.

Steve.