Why is M71 on my 3M screen?

[Mud]

You can see in the attached photos that M71 is showing on the top line of the screen on my FP4NC w/ Siemens 3M control. It's there on every screen, plus on the Automatic screen and the Jog screen G% shows up too, and they blink on those screens. I can't find any reference to this in the manuals, but none of the screenshots in the manuals show these characters. Anyone here know what this means, or how to get rid of it? It's been there since I powered it up.

 

[Martin P]

Interesting problem. I could not find an answer in my early 80ies 3M manuals at first glance (and which are not very didactic in any case).
But the 3M evolved over time through I think at least 3 iterations. Which one is yours?
I have found a reference to an M71 command in a Sinumerik 810D, which is much newer of course.
In the 810D M71 indicates the turning on of the optional compressed air blower. M72 turns it off. This may be the gizmo that blows out the taper before inserting a new tool.
It could also be some other on/off mode.
Is your machine a tool change machine (if yes, did you buy it in New Jersey)? Are any unusual gizmos installed anywhere that might need turning on and off? Suspicious mounting brackets anywhere?
My old 3M documentation is not for the later 3M versions. On the older 3M no line for M-commands seems to have been allocated in the top row. That may have come later or was ommitted in the earlier documentation.
My money would be on an on/off type function you just need to turn off.

On edit: it seems different manufacturers used M71 for different functions, which is not surprising, it being one of many available auxilliary functions. In a Siemens manual I also found this reference: "C axis operation is deselected with M71". Do you have a C axis? I would find it odd though, if the de-selection of a function would permanently display on the screen.

 

[Mud]

How do I determine which version of 3M I have? It's a 1987 machine. No tool changer, no accessories, just a plain old FP4NC. Never had a rotary axis installed. Previous owner (pops) was the original purchaser. He told me to turn the rapid override switch on and that got rid of the G% and the blinking of the M71 (which showed on the Automatic and MDA screens, not the Automatic and Jog as I originally posted). When I turn on the Test run feed rate switch it changes the M71 to FMAX on those two screens. Reset button has no effect, Estop, and other switches have no effect. The rotary switch on the control unit is set to 0 and the dip switch is off. I was in the memory to change DNC parameters, that didn't change this.

Could the G% just mean rapid mode? (G0?)

 

[Martin P]

I do not know much about the 3M.
I would still think the M71 is an activated mode.
Since that machine was a flip head machine it is post 1985. A more exact date should be found on the yellow acceptance sheet in the cabinet on documentation markings.
In any case it should be a later version of the 3M. Siemens also marked the exact version on the control. Look for sticker on the control box in the cabinet. This would normally also tell the options installed using a reference sheet. But since Deckel installed the control, its just going to be the normal set-up. Since Deckels in the US were rarely upgraded (as opposed to the german ones) the sticker will likely show the actual version (like GA0, G1, GA2).
With this you can go into the Siemens documentation center online and find interesting manuals.
Keep us posted of what you can find.

PS I have said before, that eventhought the 3M is very unpopular it seems to be a far more professional (I say professional, I do not say user friendly) control then the Grundig one. From the complexity and structure you could probably also use it to run an atomic power plant. There are a LOT of settings accessable and even more behind passwords. At least on my Sinumerik 810. It is a very impressive control. Then you look for info on the 3M you should not disregard the 3T and 3TT manuals (T for turning). Some of the basic stuff should be the same. I also have bought some stuff on EBay when it was really cheap.

 

[Milacron]

I have found a reference to an M71 command in a Sinumerik 810D, which is much newer of course.
In the 810D M71 indicates the turning on of the optional compressed air blower. M72 turns it off. This may be the gizmo that blows out the taper before inserting a new tool.

Seems to me that must be it then. I wouldn't think a company would arbitrary change the meanings of their code numbers over the years. If a new function arose as time passed, seems like they would pick another M number that had never been used before.

This doesn't solve the mystery of why M71 is being displayed of course. Any other Deckel 3M control members on this forum ?

 

[Martin P]

I'd say Stuxnet.

Stuxnet - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Milacron]

I'd say Stuxnet.

Stuxnet - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

LOL... POPS ! were you doing any top secret government work on this thing ??

 

[pops]

I can't talk about what I made on this machine or my life will be in danger. lol.
seriously, when MUD first asked me about this M71 error code on the screen my first thought was the switch on the console that has to be turned when tool clamping in either the verticle or horizontal mode. he said the switch is set to the correct mode. I know I saw that code on the screen a long time ago but I can't remember what caused it. he said Don Sentner can't remember either. I think all the error codes in the upper right corner of the screen are PC errors or console errors, program errors and machine errors are at the bottom of the screen. It's been too long since I ran the machine to remember the less common things. sorry.

 

[FP4NC_Finster]

Just a shot in the dark here....Is the program store empty? If so you might try creating-calling up a new program#. While I'm not really up on the 3M, our D4s have thrown up some odd codes after a flush when the program store is empty.

 

[Mud]

I looked for a sticker, can't find one other than the little yellow labels on each card in the control. No yellow acceptance sheet that I can find, either. This has the expanded memory option, and screen graphics. Yes, very advanced control for the 80's, The instructions and user interface are a puzzlement at times, but I'm impressed so far.

The H/V switch seems to work normally for tool changing, does it affect anything other than the power drawbars?

On the chance that it's about the battery backup I left the power on continuously for 24 hours so far, no change yet.

There are 3 subprograms in memory, and a small main program that I wrote longhand and downloaded while getting the DNC working. It runs OK.

I did discover by trial and error that the programs need a % character as the last line in order to upload and store correctly. No mention or illustration of this in the manual that I've found so far - is this normal for the 3M?

 

[AlfaGTA]

The H/V switch seems to work normally for tool changing, does it affect anything other than the power drawbars?

Yes. Because of the way the spindles are geared the vertical and horizontal turn opposite each other to make everything run forward with the correct code the logic in the control reverses the main motor rotation when you change spindle orientation.

Cheers Ross

 

[Mud]

I understand. I've switched between H and V a few times, changed tools, etc, with no affect on the M71.

 

[diamondman]

Hi,
never had a m71, they are right about a pc error but I don't know what it is.
The g% is controlled by the rapid override switch on your operators counsel.
When you rapid with the g% in the feed override switch doesn't slow it down only your feed rates.
hope this helps,
Dave

 

[Ww685]

hi there,

I have that on my 3M as well. does not seem to effect the running of the machine at all. check the position of the toggle switch in the control cabinet that allows you to upload subprograms and change the macros. just a wild stab in the dark that one. Don I find seems to know the most about these controls and is super helpful

Jim

 

[Rub87]

quite some years have passed, did anyone found already the meaning of the M71? I must have srolled through 1000's of pages of the pdf manuals, my head is not getting alot brighter from it. another thing I cannot seem to find is a way to zero the axes on a workpiece. like in a Dialog one can just drive any axis to anywhere and type X0 and it will set the X readout at 0 or whatever you typed, like X5 if one is licking an edge of a workpiece with a 10mm mill.

in the 3M I only found the chapter zero offsets (chapter 8.2 in the manual) where there are like 12 of them. unsure if this is what im after. Ive also noticed on the board 03315/6 once could connect a probe but how this then setup in the 3M to read that in and use it for reference point determination or tool length or so is unclear.

 

[Martin P]

Tell me, are you not impressed by the control?
Whenever I see the manuals I have to think of all the features, tables, settings, options they thought of in the early 80ies when they developed that stuff. And they had to document in a way so that anyone could use their control in the turning/milling integration and application. The manuals are terrible from an educational point of view, but they impress me each time.
The Deckel manuals on the 3M and Dialog are much more on the surface since the user did not need to know most stuff.

 

[Rub87]

The control is sick really. If you think about the era it was made.

 

[Martin P]

Wow graphics!
Do you know if you have the last SW version? (I don`t which one that is though)

 

[Rub87]

how to tell..? ive read in the manual that parameter 381 gets overwritten w the SW version in the EEPROM. it says 3307. no idea what means.

 

[Martin P]

I do not know how to tell.
I have some little info where Deckel was advertising SW updates for the 3M.
Even for the Dialog 11 the info is sketchy, but Deckel did advertise updates to their customers and described the benefits of getting the updates. Of course they never mentioned the bug-fixes that they packaged in there too. For updates during the production run they also printed manuals. For later updates the infos get less and less.
Your parameters show 1990 and 1995 dates, so that seems fairly late.
I still have some 3M punch tape and have to read it out to see if there is any info or dates in there, I doubt it. But good excuse to make noise with the tape reader. Love that thing.