10EE Mysterious and Major Oil Leak-or Oil Dump

[Leland Means]

After having the gearbox out of my 10EE (thanks for the help I got here) and putting it back, cleaned muck and mire and freshened sight glasses, etc, put fresh oil in the headstock and it leaks leaks leaks. But where can it be leaking from when the left side cover area has a lake of oil but none seeping down. There is this oil line next to the end gears that disappears into the headstock somehow. I can't see where it goes let alone understand what it does. Anybody had this kind of issue?

 

[Cal Haines]

I suspect that you've over-filled the headstock. The line in the second photo is the headstock overflow drain line. If the headstock is over-filled, it drains oil into a depression or oil pan that's cast into the top of the base and includes the area where you found the "lake of oil". There should be a drain hole in the pan, directly under the spindle, that lets the oil drain into the chip pan, but yours has become plugged or painted shut (common). Some models have additional drain ports.

If you take the top cover off of the headstock look carefully in the left rear corner you can find the opening that feeds the overflow drain line. I bet you'll find that the oil level is at or above the opening.


This post shows the drain pan and overflow tube for a round-dial 10EE:

10 ee round dial oil leak tear down question.....

I have been searching here and other locations on the web regarding an oil leak issue I am having on my "new to me" 1942 round dial 10EE. I hope someone may be able to help me. When I add oil to my rear headstock bearing, the sight glass fills to the correct level and within minutes it has...

www.practicalmachinist.com

More information here:

Headstock spindle drain line routing

Finally getting close to the end of this rebuild, 2 years into a 6 month resto. As I'm filling various parts of the lathe with oil to chase leaks, I overfill the spindle area and quickly realize the drain line isn't hooked up. Found where I stashed it and couldn't figure out where it is...

www.practicalmachinist.com

 

[Leland Means]

I suspect that you've over-filled the headstock. The line in the second photo is the headstock overflow drain line. If the headstock is over-filled, it drains oil into a depression or oil pan that's cast into the top of the base and includes the area where you found the "lake of oil". There should be a drain hole in the pan, directly under the spindle, that lets the oil drain into the chip pan, but yours has become plugged or painted shut (common). Some models have additional drain ports.

If you take the top cover off of the headstock look carefully in the left rear corner you can find the opening that feeds the overflow drain line. I bet you'll find that the oil level is at or above the opening.
View attachment 428595

This post shows the drain pan and overflow tube for a round-dial 10EE:

10 ee round dial oil leak tear down question.....

I have been searching here and other locations on the web regarding an oil leak issue I am having on my "new to me" 1942 round dial 10EE. I hope someone may be able to help me. When I add oil to my rear headstock bearing, the sight glass fills to the correct level and within minutes it has...

www.practicalmachinist.com

More information here:

Headstock spindle drain line routing

Finally getting close to the end of this rebuild, 2 years into a 6 month resto. As I'm filling various parts of the lathe with oil to chase leaks, I overfill the spindle area and quickly realize the drain line isn't hooked up. Found where I stashed it and couldn't figure out where it is...

www.practicalmachinist.com

Aha! I can quit referring to this lathe as the Exxon Valdeez. Thanks for your continue help with this and the links. I do like the idea of the overflow bottle under the lathe. As much as I do not want to remove the gearbox again I will do so and tidy things up in there (again).
May I impose upon you with two more questions. One, where is the gearbox overflow? I have not found such a thing. And two, the attached picture shows the two nuts holding the large bushings in the headstock. They were both loose and the bushing on the right had moved allowing the oil line to fall out. It was in the bottom of the cavity along with a mysterious piece of round brass rod about 3/16" in diameter. As the two screws need to be just set into a recess and not tightened down (or the gears won't turn) would a bit of locktite or double set screws be in order. I can't quite see how they are supposed to stay in position. Thanks again for your help.
Leland Means

 

[Leland Means]

You called it Cal. Found all those sealed up drains and lots of good old yuck is on its way to the chip pan. Thanks so much!
LM

 

[Cal Haines]

Here's a cross-section of the rear spindle bearing for an early model square-dial 10EE:

The setscrews that you're referring to are dog-point- or extended-tip-type setscrews. They go into the green hole and the tip goes into a hole in the top of the clutch gear bushing (EE-2888, yellow). They are intended to keep the bushing from rotating or sliding in the bore, but are NOT intended to apply any clamping or radial force to the bushing. You'll want to pull the setscrews out and verify that they're the correct type. Inspect the hole and verify that the hole in the bushing is lined up with the threaded hole. Check the length of the screw vs. the depth of the hole, so you'll know how deep they need to go be properly seated. Re-install them with you favorite thread-locking compound, running them in to the proper depth an snugging them up. Do NOT torque them down or you'll distort the bushing.

I don't recognize the brass cylinder as anything that belongs in the headstock. What are its dimensions? Monarch uses brass slugs like that below setscrews when they're trying to protect something like a threaded shaft from being damaged by the tip of the setscrew, but there's nothing like that in the headstock.

If you're asking about the feed/thread gearbox (quick change gearbox), as far as I know, there is no overflow for it. The center of the headstock is the only oil reservoir with an overflow like that and not all models of 10EE have them.

 

[Leland Means]

Thanks Cal. That is exactly what I thought but needed verification. The bushings are in the right place and the screws are dog points. I shall threadlock them in. I am just a bit surprised that they were not locked in as that allowed loosening, the oiler falling to the bottom (without getting badly chewed) and the bushing to move. But I am getting used to surprises inside this gem. The brass piece does look like a screw slug. Now it is on to the apron and the the mystery of why the oil pump cam bracket EE3533 broke (and then was badly welded and broke again). Lots of "history" in these tools. I certainly appreciate you taking the time to so thoroughly respond to questions like mine. It really flattens out learning curves.
LM

 

[rimcanyon]

The headstock overflow is the copper line in your second photo in the first post.

The oil that is shown in the first photo (lake of oil) should not be there. There are one or two holes that drain that area into the sump below the bed, so the holes are probably plugged with paint and crud. Try probing with a piece of wire on the left side.

The source of that oil is the headstock overflow.

The gearbox also leaks, but it has its own weep hole into the sump. The gearbox leaks around the shifter shaft (the one with the forward reverse feed plate). There is a packing screw that needs to be tightened occasionally to stop it from leaking.

 

[Leland Means]

After much poking with an awl I found and cleaned all 5 drains. And I will be sure to check the screw on the shifter shaft. Sounds like another spot for some thread locker. Thanks for your response I really appreciate y'all taking the time to help me out with this.

 

[rimcanyon]

The packing nut on the shifter shaft is slotted. To tighten it, you can make a spanner to fit around the shaft and engage the slots, or you can use a screwdriver and tap it with a hammer. You don't want to go too tight, or you won't be able to turn the shaft to shift from feed to threading.