Fadal memory batteries, when to change?

[jdj]

The Fadal repair guys claim that 14 years isn't any problem for the batteries to live AND keep going. Really? That seems like a little much to ask from a battery. Even today's technology, let alone 1997's. What say you? And WHY in the hell do they solder them to the boards? I know that this is common, but WHY?
Make them interchangeable like NORMAL shit that uses batteries. WTF?
The whole business of how you turn the machine off, seems odd as well. Why not a simple ON/OFF switch/button(s)? Turn the main breaker off? Really? No other way? Yeah! Great idea!(roll eyes) Batteries NOT recharging during that time! Haven't had a problem YET...but DON'T WANT TO! Know what I mean?

Jeff

 

[Speedie]

Yes they may last 30 years because they are industrial lithium rechargable that really dont use much power when the machine is off. Its a purple battery on your 1010-X board which is soldered onto the board. The battery is about $35.

 

[Bobw]

I've never heard of someone losing a battery on a Fadal. I never actually even thought about it.

That might be something interesting for FadalCNC to address in their "tech tips" they e-mail out every couple weeks. See what they have to say about it.

 

[Scott H]

Both of my Fadal's are 20 years old. I did not even know they had a battery. I replace the batteries in my Fanuc machines every year. Now you have got me thinking.

Thanks,

Scott

 

[Edster]

Even if you loose the battery it would take all of 5 minutes to re-enter the parameters. You do have them backed up right? All three screens

 

[billystein]

i have a customer with a 94 4020. he bought it to do his thermoforming molds in house. after sitting for a year or two the batteries ran down and lost all the parameter settings. and it killed the battery. besides that i have not had battery issues.

 

[jdj]

I replace the batteries in my Fanuc machines every year. Now you have got me thinking.

Thanks,

Scott

Ya know what I mean?!?!

Jeff

 

[jdj]

Yes they may last 30 years because they are industrial lithium rechargable that really dont use much power when the machine is off. Its a purple battery on your 1010-X board which is soldered onto the board. The battery is about $35.

Thanks, I THOUGHT I new where It (they) were, but is has been a while since I looked. 30 years? I don't know why, but that seems like a LONG time considering that all other ones I know of are lucky to last 3 or 4 years!

Jeff

 

[scadvice]

My Fadal...

...a 1996 sat for 2 yrs before I bought it and then again for about 5 yrs without losing parameters.

Steve

 

[in2glamisgirl]

Battery life

My oldest Fadal is a 1987, still on the original battery. Have not even thought about in ten years. 2017 it will get a new one. maybe


Fanuc on the other hand I change them every year just to be safe. The D cell's it uses are not long life batteries.

 

[_MO_]

On the the 1988 4020 we have the battery would last about a week with the power off before it lost its parameters. Ended up having the CPU board replace because of other issues and it seems to have a newer battery on it. At least it goes longer than a week before it forgets who it is.

It doesn't take too long to enter the parameters back into memory. The other thing I do if I'm not using the machine regularly is turn it on every couple of weeks to let the battery charge and move the axes around.

MO

 

[aarongough]

Sorry for necro-posting! Just making an update here instead of creating a new thread as this page is the first result in Google when searching 'Fadal Replacement Battery'.

A small correction:
The battery that's soldered onto the main board on a Fadal is NOT rechargeable. The battery is a 3.6V, AA sized battery with "Lithium Thionyl-Chloride" chemistry. This type of battery is designed for applications where a very small amount of current needs to be drawn over a VERY long period of time.

There IS a 'rechargeable' element to how Fadals keep power to their memory chips, but it is not the battery. Instead there is actually a small 'super-capacitor' next to the battery, which you can see here:


The super-capacitor is charged up every time the machine is powered on, and when the machine is powered back off the super-capacitor will supply memory backup power for days (maybe a week or two?), then once that runs out the lithium battery takes over. If you power cycle your machines regularly the lithium battery will never even be used which is part of why they can last such a long time.

The original battery specified for the memory backup on a Fadal was a 'Tadiran TL-2100/S' however this is now an obsolete part. Tadiran has replaced it with a new model that has a slightly larger capacity, the new model number is 'Tadiran TL-5903'.

I was trying to source a replacement battery for one of my machines and found a few options, but some of them looked sketchy. To my surprise McMaster actually stocks both the obsolete part and the newer version:
TL-2100: https://www.mcmaster.com/2171n13/
TL-5903: https://www.mcmaster.com/2171N15/

The only difference between the original and the new version is the capacity. The old version (TL-2100) is 2,100mA/h capacity and the new version (TL-5903) has 2,400mA/h capacity. In the case where you need to replace the battery in your Fadal I would go with the TL-5903 as it's only $2 more expensive and will last a bit longer!

Hope this is helpful for someone else.
-Aaron

 

[RC Mech]

I keep plugging ITS CNC, but they’ve been quite helpful with my Fadals. I did purchase batteries from them when the one on my ‘98 15XT died. Hadn’t used it in about 5 months and when I did turn it on it didn’t know it was a mill.

 

[in2glamisgirl]

There is a battery check button and led on this board next to the battery, I was told to check with the power on to machine, the led should light up.

I have had to replace a few batteries with the Mc Master unit. I found it convenient to clip the old leads off 1/4" above the board and solder the new battery to the existing pig tails, avoiding having to solder onto the board traces.
The parameters and programs stayed intact the 15 minutes the board was out of the machine.

 

[aarongough]

Yes I like ITSCNC as well for Fadal parts, however for small stuff like a battery the cost of shipping and duties to Canada can make ordering with them a bit painful, whereas McMaster Carr shipping to Canada is cheap, fast and easy. For larger stuff like thrust bearings and so on ITS is definitely my go-to at the moment though!

Here are a few better photos of the battery / super-cap area of the board just for posterity:






Misc details for posterity:
- The super-cap specs are 5.5v, 1 Farad, 0.4" lead pitch. Likely replacement: https://www.digikey.ca/en/products/detail/kemet/FS0H105ZF/4290875
- The lead-to-lead spacing for the battery on the board is approximately 54.3mm (2.13").

The reason for listing the lead-to-lead distance is because I'd rather replace the battery with a battery holder instead of a new solder-in battery if I can. The battery on this board has clearly been replaced at least once already (dirty flux left on solder pads), so I may as well make it easy if I ever need to do it again.

This AA battery holder looks like it's a perfect fit for the board, with 54.5mm pin spacing and 15.5mm width: https://www.digikey.ca/en/products/detail/keystone-electronics/1015/2745664

Once the holder is fitted that means I can use the even higher capacity 'button top' battery from McMaster that does not have axial leads: https://www.mcmaster.com/6951K57/

I may replace the super-cap while I'm at it, as the one on my board is missing part of its shrink-wrap and may be damaged.