New Business Advice

[memphisjed]

Most absurd business to get in these days.

Absolutely your going to be on the radar of the city as soon as you even think of starting a plating business. and their going to be up your arse from day one

Plating

The only person who could possible make it work would be somebody who had extensive experience in plating, otherwise forget about it

On city map for tax breaks. There are 6 platers here in town (that I know of) more south of here in mississippi. We are not a rust belt area- and 6. Only one does one off work, and it has to be special enough for them to even price that. One south of here got Mississippi tax breaks (welfare for businesses) to open in new building- chrome plating fishing lure parts that are made in India. I would hope someone in the business has experience. Restaurants to convenience stores all have skills.
Hard chrome cams are plated in a lean two by a creek.... far from under the radar operation.

 

[604Pook]

On city map for tax breaks. There are 6 platers here in town (that I know of) more south of here in mississippi. We are not a rust belt area- and 6. Only one does one off work, and it has to be special enough for them to even price that. One south of here got Mississippi tax breaks (welfare for businesses) to open in new building- chrome plating fishing lure parts that are made in India. I would hope someone in the business has experience. Restaurants to convenience stores all have skills.
Hard chrome cams are plated in a lean two by a creek.... far from under the radar operation.

slowly dying out here in Canada, I know car guys sending stuff to California, which they then send it to mexico to be chromed.

 

[kccmelty]

I want to start a machine shop because manufacturing is my passion, and my experience in production planning and machining gives me confidence in this direction. I agree that our best bet is the local market. Our 3D printing company succeeded by supporting local engineers who needed parts faster than companies outside of the region could provide, mainly due to shipping delays.

We are located in the Minneapolis area where there is a high demand for medical parts. Approval for ISO13485 is planned based on workload.

When it comes to competing with overseas shops, we need to work as efficiently as possible. Starting from scratch and implementing automation is one way to achieve this. This will allow us to maximize unattended hours and keep the spindle turning. It's not about having the fastest programs or equipment to reduce lead times, but rather having a steady process in place.

Thanks again for all of the feedback. We do need to hear honest opinions from other people in the industry.

 

[boosted]

When it comes to competing with overseas shops, we need to work as efficiently as possible. Starting from scratch and implementing automation is one way to achieve this. This will allow us to maximize unattended hours and keep the spindle turning. It's not about having the fastest programs or equipment to reduce lead times, but rather having a steady process in place.

Thanks again for all of the feedback. We do need to hear honest opinions from other people in the industry.

The issue is that China is also automated. There is no such thing as competing with SE Asia on cost, period. Every time I hear somebody tell me they are going to compete with China by embracing automation, my eyes gloss over. Talk to anybody at a machine tool builder about which part of the world has more machine tool technology... In many respects we are trailing them.

And I say this as somebody who has lots of experience with pallet fed machines, including owning a couple of them. I've spent an absurd amount of money on pallet pools, zero point fixturing, digital tool databases, etc.... etc... There are a bunch of reasons to embrace automation, but thinking it will give you an edge on foreign competition is just naive.

 

[604Pook]

The issue is that China is also automated. There is no such thing as competing with SE Asia on cost, period. Every time I hear somebody tell me they are going to compete with China by embracing automation, my eyes gloss over. Talk to anybody at a machine tool builder about which part of the world has more machine tool technology... In many respects we are trailing them.

And I say this as somebody who has lots of experience with pallet fed machines, including owning a couple of them. I've spent an absurd amount of money on pallet pools, zero point fixturing, digital tool databases, etc.... etc... There are a bunch of reasons to embrace automation, but thinking it will give you an edge on foreign competition is just naive.

Especially when they buy all the automation for pennies on the dollar...including their cnc machines. They can outfit a shop with 10 machines with automation for the cost of a few machines and no automation. Western countries have slit their own throats as far as manufacturing goes....red tape, taxes and high cost of living.

 

[boosted]

Especially when they buy all the automation for pennies on the dollar...including their cnc machines. They can outfit a shop with 10 machines with automation for the cost of a few machines and no automation. Western countries have slit their own throats as far as manufacturing goes....red tape, taxes and high cost of living.

We're on the same side of this argument, but I truly believe that much is lost when we focus too much on taxes and environmental policies.

SE Asia is now the world manufacturing hub. They are much closer to the source of almost every value added resource that is required to manufacture a good, and therefore will always have a massive cost advantage. Even if all subsidies, tariffs, and regulations were instantly and magically removed, that region would still have an exponentially more robust manufacturing infrastructure than we have in the US. Even if I paid zero taxes and could dump our waste coolant down the storm drain - China would easily beat my shop on pricing every time.

I do not think that deregulation is the answer. Breaking our addiction to cheap Chinese manufactured goods in the answer, and I suspect the only way to do that at this point would be through government intervention.

 

[machinistrrt]

Consider a hot dog cart. Or go to the top with a food truck.
In all seriousness, the trouble with a mature economy is most niches are filled.

 

[MwTech Inc]

I want to start a machine shop because manufacturing is my passion,

That's all good, however "passion does not equate success"
IMHO get a job again and start up a gig on the side in your garage........you'll find out soon enough if it will fly.....

 

[Mebfab]

I just got back from the design 2 part show. I would guess over 1/2 of the booths are pedling machined parts. And nothing stood out between them. Even the Chinese had booths........

 

[Farmer Phil]

. I do not think that deregulation is the answer. Breaking our addiction to cheap Chinese manufactured goods in the answer, and I suspect the only way to do that at this point would be through government intervention.

How sure are you that we are not here because of government intervention?

 

[YangTseng]

I just got back from the design 2 part show. I would guess over 1/2 of the booths are pedling machined parts. And nothing stood out between them. Even the Chinese had booths........

Foreign shop without a real facility locate in North America is not allowed to attend d2p show.

 

[YangTseng]

We're on the same side of this argument, but I truly believe that much is lost when we focus too much on taxes and environmental policies.

SE Asia is now the world manufacturing hub. They are much closer to the source of almost every value added resource that is required to manufacture a good, and therefore will always have a massive cost advantage. Even if all subsidies, tariffs, and regulations were instantly and magically removed, that region would still have an exponentially more robust manufacturing infrastructure than we have in the US. Even if I paid zero taxes and could dump our waste coolant down the storm drain - China would easily beat my shop on pricing every time.

I do not think that deregulation is the answer. Breaking our addiction to cheap Chinese manufactured goods in the answer, and I suspect the only way to do that at this point would be through government intervention.

Government intervention is loser's mindset.
Competitive advantage is driving force for efficient economy.
I personally bought a lot of Vanguard ETFs, the financial product from the United States is god damn good, the cost are lowest around the world, and that is because of the strong competitive advantage of the financial sector in America.
I have to pay 30% of the dividend tax to the US government, and our government got "0" from my investment.

 

[William Chloe]

I heard that they want to reduce the tax rate to 25%

Government intervention is loser's mindset.
Competitive advantage is driving force for efficient economy.
I personally bought a lot of Vanguard ETFs, the financial product from the United States is god damn good, the cost are lowest around the world, and that is because of the strong competitive advantage of the financial sector in America.
I have to pay 30% of the dividend tax to the US government, and our government got "0" from my investment.

I heard that they want to reduce the tax rate to 25%.

 

[604Pook]

We're on the same side of this argument, but I truly believe that much is lost when we focus too much on taxes and environmental policies.

SE Asia is now the world manufacturing hub. They are much closer to the source of almost every value added resource that is required to manufacture a good, and therefore will always have a massive cost advantage. Even if all subsidies, tariffs, and regulations were instantly and magically removed, that region would still have an exponentially more robust manufacturing infrastructure than we have in the US. Even if I paid zero taxes and could dump our waste coolant down the storm drain - China would easily beat my shop on pricing every time.

I do not think that deregulation is the answer. Breaking our addiction to cheap Chinese manufactured goods in the answer, and I suspect the only way to do that at this point would be through government intervention.

100% agree, we don't produce very much of the raw materials needed to make anything. I

I have bought things which I thought were made here in Canada from a Canadian company, but what it was actually, was a Canadian company taking raw canadian wood, shipping it to china to manufacture, then shipping it back to Canada.

My brother in law, just had the same thing happen with a "Canadian" kitchen cabinet company, they designed the stuff here, have all the boxes, doors, hardware etc, made in China and then flat packed shipped by the container to Canada (multiple kitchens worth) They then assembled it here. I don't get how it costs less to do that then to just run a cnc router here, but the red tape, regulations etc, have made it almost impossible to run a wood shop in the lower mainland of BC Canada. You need a $150,000 dust collector just to open the doors to start your business. I have known a few long time shops that have shut down now, due to Workers Comp and city inspectors, that have now shut down because the long time owners, are almost ready to retire, and the red tape people have come along with their clipboard and have issued orders for them to upgrade their dust systems. Some were issued $1500 a day fines until they complied. Most said early retirement looked like a better option and shut down, with 10-20 employees now losing their jobs.

 

[MwTech Inc]

Ignorant government regulating the infrastructure right out of their country......
The epitome of stupidity....
not just up there either.......it's everywhere...

I know......let's just say the dust identifies as clean air....now we have no problem.
We let other "things" identify what they want to be , why not dust??

Fair is fair

 

[Donkey Hotey]

I don't get how it costs less to do that then to just run a cnc router here, but the red tape, regulations etc, have made it almost impossible to run a wood shop in the lower mainland of BC Canada.

Not really shipping to another country but, I remember being in Honolulu. All the gift stores have mountains of Mauna Loa macadamia nuts to buy for your friends and family back home. Mauna Loa...Los Angeles, CA.

Yes, the nuts were grown in Hawaii, shipped to Los Angeles, processed, packaged and shipped back to Hawaii...so I could buy them, pack them in my luggage and take them to my family...in Los Angeles. Shipping must be extraordinarily cheap.

 

[604Pook]

Ignorant government regulating the infrastructure right out of their country......
The epitome of stupidity....
not just up there either.......it's everywhere...

I know......let's just say the dust identifies as clean air....now we have no problem.
We let other "things" identify what they want to be , why not dust??

Fair is fair

My family's business is now required on top of the fancy big $ dust collector, to do a monthly dusting/vacuuming of all the roof joists in their wood shop.

 

[john.k]

Makes sense ...dust explosions are two stage ...first one aerates all the settled dust in the building ,second one is the biggie,all the aerated dust explodes and levels the lot.

 

[604Pook]

Makes sense ...dust explosions are two stage ...first one aerates all the settled dust in the building ,second one is the biggie,all the aerated dust explodes and levels the lot.

Hasn't been an issue in 40 plus years. 3000sq' of wood shop with 20' to bottom of joists and 24' to ceiling, and full of equipment, it's not a small or quick job to do. Basically costs a day of production to get done ( 2 guys wages/benefits and the loss of revenue.) it adds up.

 

[MwTech Inc]

That is just so stupid, stupid..........can't even grasp how stupid that is..........
We had a full commercial woodshop........never vac'ed my beams
I've walked thru other shops where the sawdust was a foot thick in places.......still there.
Pretty soon we will all have to wear charcoal masks in case someone has bad breath........ nobody will be offended.