South Bend 13" - "Not" A Good Choice?

[bradjacob]

Brad,

Show some pictures of the handy work you have done on your lathe restorations.

John

Here are the links to my lathe restorations. I've included both video and (Practical Machinsist) thread links.

Videos (grab some popcorn, these are 1/2 hour videos!)
Heavy-10 Slideshow
9a Slideshow

Build Threads
Heavy 10 Build Thread
9a Build Thread
South Bend Drill Press Build Thread

 

[jim rozen]

Heh. It's pretty apparent that most gunsmiths would not spend the time or effort to produce a brad-quality
re-build on a lathe. But I will make a couple of comments that address points already made:

1) there are current production shops using SB 13s right now. I worked in one. The shop had two Okuma
LB lathes, one Okuma Cadet, two large gear-heads of german manufacture. And, in the toolroom arm
of that facility, a SB13. And yes the SB got a fair bit of airplay for doing fixture setup and re-work of
one-off manufacture jobs. Seems like it was just the 'right size' for much of the stuff that happened in that
part of the shop. Maybe it was the vintage of the guys running it, who knows.

2) monarch 10ees are nice lathes, no doubt about it. Buy one with the WIAD and you'll rapidly discover,
being a gunsmith is NOT the same thing as being an electrical engineer. Probably any businessman gunsmith
who can afford a 10ee can afford to just *pay* somebody to wrange the fire-bottles in there. But the
number of vintage EEs who can work on vintage stuff is rapidly dwindling. To the point were one of the biggest
topics of conversation on the monarch sub-forum is, how can I replace the drive in that machine with something
that a) works better or b) works.

Not being a gunsmith I doubt I can make a sensible contribution to the question 'what's the best gunsmith lathe'
but it probably sounds something like either 'the one that has the lowest operating cost' or 'the one that makes me
the most money.'

Lathes are probably like motorcycles - the most important thing is the guy behind the controls.

 

[Bruce Nelson]

When I bought my Heavy 10 from Ferrous Antiquos, it fortunately came with a 3-phase motor. So I hooked it up to a VFD. I was interested to hear the theory that single phase power has some harmonic problems that can be telegraphed to the finish being produced. This was the first that I had heard of this. Several people have confirmed this, so you have a believer. I liked what the Russians did in using stored power from a flywheel to isolate the vibration. It has been my experience that replacing v-belts with link belts also reduces vibration. I still think that the best all around lathe that can be had for all around versatility in a industrial, school, and home setting is a South Bend 13 with a D1-4 spindle, a factory taper attachment, a lever actuated collet closer, steady rest, follower rest, 3 and 4 jaw chucks, and a 6 jaw Adjust-tru chuck. I wish I had one, but will make do with my Heavy 10. These aren't production machines, but you can do practically any lathe job with them fast and accurately. Too bad they quit making them, but there are enough of them out there to last me as long as I last.

Lord Byron

 

[speerchucker30x3]

I have been running link belts on all my machines for about 20 years Bruce. When I thread with taps 1/2 inch and up in the lathe I lock the tap in the tailstock in an ER 32 collet. Then I set the speed to 350, turn on the machine, push the leaver to tighten the belt and wind the machine up to speed. I slide the tailstock forward and the tap bites and sucks the tailstock straight up until the tap bottoms and the belt slips. I have had the same belts on that machine for 15 years. Once every 2 years I have to pull out one link to tighten it back up. There is no way you could abuse normal belts like that and not change them every couple of years or so. They may be expensive but they are well worth the money for the longevity and they don't turn your hands black all the time either. The best part is that you don't have to slip out the spindle to put new belts on back gear lathes.

 

[Swarfboy71]

Can you put a picture up of the link belts you are referring to? Wondering if they are the same I have on a old mill I have at home.

 

[Bruce Nelson]

I buy mine from Farmtek.com.

Lord Byron

 

[speerchucker30x3]

I got mine from Lee Valley Tool years back but Busy Bee and KMS tools carry them as well. Busy Bee is the cheapest here. It ranges from $10 to $15 per foot so the average back gear machine is from $60 to $100 to outfit but well worth it.

BELT LINK B/5L 5/8IN. PRICED PER FOOT - Busy Bee Tools

 

[Swarfboy71]

Thanks for the info on link belts. I found my local industrial supplies place stocks them. I have an old universal mill that has them. I thought they were a thing of the past. (Have not fired mill up yet.was given it but it has a 3 phase motor.)

I have a back gear lathe so I will get some for when the spindle belt fails.

 

[steve-l]

When I bought my Heavy 10 from Ferrous Antiquos, it fortunately came with a 3-phase motor. So I hooked it up to a VFD. I was interested to hear the theory that single phase power has some harmonic problems that can be telegraphed to the finish being produced. This was the first that I had heard of this. Several people have confirmed this, so you have a believer. I liked what the Russians did in using stored power from a flywheel to isolate the vibration. It has been my experience that replacing v-belts with link belts also reduces vibration. I still think that the best all around lathe that can be had for all around versatility in a industrial, school, and home setting is a South Bend 13 with a D1-4 spindle, a factory taper attachment, a lever actuated collet closer, steady rest, follower rest, 3 and 4 jaw chucks, and a 6 jaw Adjust-tru chuck. I wish I had one, but will make do with my Heavy 10. These aren't production machines, but you can do practically any lathe job with them fast and accurately. Too bad they quit making them, but there are enough of them out there to last me as long as I last.

Lord Byron

I have one of those late model 13x40 SB. I bought it as scrap weight from the USAF. It had fallen off a forklift face first and was truly trashed. I then spent 18 mos repairing it, but in the end, found all the necessary parts from SB, but they had to order them from Taiwan, which is where it was made. It is equipped just as you described, except for the lever collet closer. I have several different collet chucks and matching collets. It has a taper attachment which is differential and that is very handy. I have one follower and two steady rests, two set-tru 3 jaws, two independent 4 jaws and a 6 jaw. The only drawback it has is lubing the lead screw drive, as the gear cover must be removed first, and the limited number of threads it can cut (My 10L actually cuts more threads) It is equipped with a 3HP 400V 3phase motor. It has plenty of power. (I regularly cut .250 in 1018 without a problem) It also has a coolant tank and pump.
Steve

 

[bradjacob]

My 13" has a 2hp, 220v motor (single phase). I *may* replace this (in time) ad go the 3-phase/VFD route. Once I install my (still in the box) VFD on my Bridgeport, I'll know more about them and have a better idea of what's involved.

I'm making VERY good progress on my 13" restoration. I have an opportunity to get a D1-4 spindle (new). I would then need to get the right back plate for my existing Buck set-true. Ahh, how the costs always seem to rise, LOL. Currently knee deep in stripping the bed of paint. Man, that part never gets easier. I probably should update my build-thread over on the South Bend forum, huh...