Tool Life, Hydraulics, and more

[Houdini]

Also if you want a little more grip, wipe the shank and bore with any kind of alcohol before assembly.

I've been the victim of not doing this in my youth, We now have a spray bottle of alcohol at the tool change bench
tool, collets, and mating taper in tool holders get alcamahol as a last touch and blow dry!

 

[fmari --MariTool-]

I've been the victim of not doing this in my youth, We now have a spray bottle of alcohol at the tool change bench
tool, collets, and mating taper in tool holders get alcamahol as a last touch and blow dry!

It really helps. Plus it helps to remove any small particles, abrasives, and lint.

 

[Houdini]

It really helps. Plus it helps to remove any small particles, abrasives, and lint.

Doing surfacing on injection molds teaches you, CLEAN YOUR HOLDER ASSEMBLIES WITH SOLVENT!
No substitute!

 

[Houdini]

It really helps. Plus it helps to remove any small particles, abrasives, and lint.

I forgot to add to this, for any future viewers.
If you do get the small particles, or little pressure witness lines pressed into your tool tapers.
you can take some Blue Magic metal polish put a small dab, and spin it in your hands a couple times with a paper towel, and it all goes away,
keeps tools clean.
Do it sparingly, and make sure you wash them with a solvent at least twice to make sure its off, I wouldn't want it in my spindle.

You could hit the spindle taper with it also, but make sure you dont get it up in the retention system and clean it out thoroughly with solvent,
WD40 or Alcohol, mineral spirits, I prefer alcohol. (WD40 is over 80% mineral spirits)

I haven't found anything that cleans tool tapers as well as this, and I'm a little OCD on clean tooling assemblies.

You could use this REGO FIX cleaner, time consuming.
And if your tooling looks like in the video I think you need a new line of work.

 

[fmari --MariTool-]

What else can that tool holder cleaner clean? Asking for a friend. :-)

 

[Houdini]

What else can that tool holder cleaner clean? Asking for a friend. :-)

The REGO?, I don't know haven't looked into it.
Kelch has one also, there may be more.

The Kelch comes in Maritool green!

 

[KMR_MACH]

I like to read the spindle load meter when rough milling and drilling holes. When it goes up an additional 5-10% generally the tool is done. Sometimes I'll stretch them out farther if I'm near the end of a part run but that's a good stopping point.

 

[Fal Grunt]

I like to read the spindle load meter when rough milling and drilling holes. When it goes up an additional 5-10% generally the tool is done. Sometimes I'll stretch them out farther if I'm near the end of a part run but that's a good stopping point.

That is one issue with Brother’s whole “taste the rainbow” approach to spindle load.

The nice thing about small tools, in this material, is that they let you know when they are done. They just won’t be there any more!

 

[Houdini]

That is one issue with Brother’s whole “taste the rainbow” approach to spindle load.

The nice thing about small tools, in this material, is that they let you know when they are done. They just won’t be there any more!

Yup, the shitty Haas load meter isn't gonna let you know when the 1/4" tool is done!
I let those Harvey Tool Hard end mills go once just to see, they are so short and stout, I couldn't get one to brake, but that little sucker got LOUD for a little 3/16" cutter.

 

[fmari --MariTool-]

A customer had a good question on when to get an on size hydraulic chuck or over sized hydraulic chuck and use sleeves. In his situation nose diameter is no concern.

I replied with this....

When finishing it is best to get an on size hydraulic chuck. If you are using a 1/2" shank finisher, try to use a 1/2" hydraulic chuck. You have less chance of having any runout ( Our sleeves are dead nuts, but everything has a tolerance) and you will have the best dampening available.

When you are light to medium roughing it is best to jump 1 size larger of a hydraulic chuck and use a sleeve. So if you are using a 1/2" shank tool, try to use a 5/8 or 3/4 hydraulic chuck with a sleeve to reduce it. Runout isn't so much of a concern when roughing and since you are using a larger hydraulic chuck your grip will be higher. Also roughing operations have a greater chance of a tool breaking, the sleeve can act as a wear item in case the broken carbide kicks back and hits the tool holder.

I will try to put this in my FAQ section. I think this is good info and applies to all hydraulic chucks not just mine.

 

[Fal Grunt]

A customer had a good question on when to get an on size hydraulic chuck or over sized hydraulic chuck and use sleeves. In his situation nose diameter is no concern.

I replied with this....

When finishing it is best to get an on size hydraulic chuck. If you are using a 1/2" shank finisher, try to use a 1/2" hydraulic chuck. You have less chance of having any runout ( Our sleeves are dead nuts, but everything has a tolerance) and you will have the best dampening available.

When you are light to medium roughing it is best to jump 1 size larger of a hydraulic chuck and use a sleeve. So if you are using a 1/2" shank tool, try to use a 5/8 or 3/4 hydraulic chuck with a sleeve to reduce it. Runout isn't so much of a concern when roughing and since you are using a larger hydraulic chuck your grip will be higher. Also roughing operations have a greater chance of a tool breaking, the sleeve can act as a wear item in case the broken carbide kicks back and hits the tool holder.

I will try to put this in my FAQ section. I think this is good info and applies to all hydraulic chucks not just mine.

Will you be making 5/8 or 3/4 hydraulics?

Does this apply to the roughing hydraulics as well? Get a 1/2" roughing hydraulic and run a sleeve for a 3/8?

Really appreciate the info!

 

[fmari --MariTool-]

I have BT30-16mm hydraulics in process. Standard and dual contact. We have a great selection of 16mm sleeves with Inch and Metric id's.
I've had a lot of requests with my EU customers for these.

Yes, same rules apply with a roughing hydraulic.

 

[DouglasJRizzo]

@Fal Grunt Is your machine capable of using Full Contact tooling?
When I worked for Doosan/DNS we would run demos using that and saw quite an improvement in tool life.

 

[hi-fly-cnc]

Colour me interested in metric dual contact BT30 (UK). Have you got a distributor here? (Want one?)

 

[fmari --MariTool-]

Colour me interested in metric dual contact BT30 (UK). Have you got a distributor here? (Want one?)

We sell direct. Simply create an account on line and order thru our website. We ship worldwide, daily.

 

[Finegrain]

Frank, I'll put in another vote for 5/8" hydraulic chuck.

Regards.

Mike

 

[Pete Deal]

How do shrink holders compare to hydraulic holders?

And, Fal Grunt, I don’t think you said what the material you’re cutting is. Maybe you can’t for some reason? I’m very curious though. Maybe I missed it.

 

[fmari --MariTool-]

5/8 hydraulics and sleeves are also in the works.

Shrink holders have higher grip than all collet chucks, hydraulic holders. Probably tied or similar with Power Grip from Rego fix and milling chucks. Hydraulics really shine when it comes to finishing. The dampening effect realy does improve the finishes on the part you are machining and improves tool life like no other tool holder can.

 

[Pete Deal]

Pardon my ignorance but I assume that the hydraulic pressure is generated by a set screw that pushes a piston? Does the pressure ever leak down?

 

[Orange Vise]

Sleeved down hydraulics are great. As Frank said, higher gripping force, minimal to no runout, and the sleeve also protects the bore if the tool snaps.

I actually use them for finishing too and have largely done away with on-size holders.

Coolant sealed sleeves are great even if you're not using TSC. They keep contaminants out and can save a ton of time when swapping tools compared to ER and SK, which get absolutely filthy.

Pardon my ignorance but I assume that the hydraulic pressure is generated by a set screw that pushes a piston? Does the pressure ever leak down?

That's right.

I've experienced a pressure leak once on a high end German holder. 1/2" endmill in a 1/2" holder, dry cutting steel. It's possible that heat buildup caused the failure, but I can't be certain, as we're only talking mid 100s Fahrenheit. Also possible that a heavy handed operator somehow messed it up. Said operator had a history of dropping torque wrenches on the ground.

Generally I'd say hydraulic toolholder failure is rare.